Agression in doodles

[Jill Holder]

I have a 2 yr old golden doodle who occasionally shows agression toward other dogs (tail is up and he lunges or snaps at them).  He also has occasionally bit my kids or growl at them if they jump on him.  I cannot have a dog who shows any type of aggression whatsoever.  I will work with a trainer but if I cannot get this remedied then I will have to - sadly - get rid of him.  Anyone else had this problem and what their solution was???  Most of the time, Max is a friendly dog.  He just needs some training.   Thanks!

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Jill, you posted a similar discussion (Puppy Aggression) about Max being aggressive toward children and other dogs two years ago, when he was only 5 months old, and also said then you would not tolerate aggression. What training and work have you done with him since then to address these issues? You say you "will work with a trainer", and that he "just needs some training"; does that mean you did not follow through with any training for the past two years?

It is disturbing to me that you are already talking about "gettting rid of" a dog who has been a member of your family for two years. This is clearly not a new problem. There is a commitment involved when one gets a puppy, and part of that is to help the dog live in the world, through training, so that he doesn't end up homeless when he is an adult, past the cute puppy stage. Dogs are not born well-behaved, and they don't magically get that way without on-going training. All dogs need training, and they need it for life, along with consistency, boundaries, lots of socialization, and lots of exercise.

Yes, lots of members here have dogs who had this problem, and still have it, and most of them are working hard with trainers to address these behaviors, for the dogs' sakes as well as their own. There is not a solution in the sense that you take a class or a few sessions with a trainer and the problem is corrected permanently.  Join the Training group and you can learn about what others have done and are doing for aggression issues. 

If a someone jumped on me, I'd growl too. The kids also have to behave appropriately toward the dog.

I hope you will look for a trainer who is experienced in these types of issues and and can help you work with Max on these behaviors.

 

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

I am one of the members that Karen is taking about with a two year old Doodle who is highly dog reactive, and sometimes reactive to people as well.  What am I doing about it?  We have been working on this for over a year.  I have a trainer who works with us twice a week, but that's just the beginning.  We train on the dog aggression issue every single day.  We leash walk him in areas where there will be other dogs walking, and we use a reward/correction approach to influence his behavior and prevent the aggression (which is the barking, lunging and growling at some dogs).  We have come a long way in that he can now go for weeks at a time without a reaction. He has also been highly reactive to some people that we meet.. bikers, joggers, people in hats, etc. and we've made great progress with this as well.  The disheartening part is that he reverts back fairly regularly and when he does it's almost like starting from the beginning, and so this training may never stop.  I have come to believe that this is going to be a "lifetime thing" for Murphy.  It's how he's wired.  We also have to work with him throughout the day to prevent him from getting excited which always escalates.  We use a "nothing in life is free" approach to everything.  Again we've seen progress, and now I am no longer fearful of him becoming aggressive with people coming into the house.  I still do not trust him fully around children, although we've done several training sessions focused at this issue.  I have to watch him closely or he's gated in another room when there are kids in the house.  So, I guess what I'm saying is that this is going to take work and commitment.  You are also going to have to control Max's environment so that he doesn't escalate....children should NOT ever be sitting or laying on him.  He is a dog, and he will respond like a dog to this.  He will growl as a warning and then he will bite.  Your kids need training as much as Max does.  Whenever we bring a dog into our lives we are making a commitment.  There are no perfect dogs....it takes work.  I really hope you will find the right trainer and be willing to work with Max....he deserves that.  Please consider joining us in the Training Group....there's lots of great information there.

[Sequoia & Dudley]

Wow, great advice. My Dudley is highstrung also. We have learned that keeping him calm goes a long way toward curbing his aggressive tendencies. We use prevention. When the grandkids are here, he "goes home" (his crate, which we drape with a cloth all around, sort of like a parrot). When another dog and owner approach on a walk, I stop and Dudley sits beside me. We calmly wait till the other dog passes. SOMETIMES, I will allow a social moment, but the other dog has to look "compatible" with my highstrung dood. Dudley does get lots of socializing weekly at Camp Animal Ark.

At home, Dudley mostly has a big growl (to accompany his big presence), and we just stop a moment to see what is going on with him. Usually he is telling someone to respect my space (very protective of me) or not to challenge him for one of his toys or bones. 

Dudley just celebrated his 6th birthday with us. We have been working with him since he was 6 months old. His communication with us is complex. Growling is just one part of it. His struts with his toys are another part. I have learned a lot from reading, and yes, we have gone to training. Don't give up. Often the problems arise because we inadvertantly give mixed signals to our dogs. I look forward to reading your success stories with Max!

[Joanne ~ Spud*]

Training?  Please share with us what type of training he has previously had.  How old are you children?

Did you mistype when you said, He also has occasionally bit my kids or growl at them if they jump on him.

Are you saying your children are jumping on him?

Is he sick? Has he been to the vet?  Lots of questions to be answered. 

[Kimberly Risley]

I don't have a Goldendoodle yet, but have had a lot of dogs in my past and didn't have any aggressive dogs. Most of our dogs where "mutts". The research I have done on these dogs is they are not aggressive, but having kids "jump" on him will probably cause any dog to become aggressive.

I would have training for the kids and dog. When my husband's grandkids come to our house I watch them around our cat so they do not get to aggressive with the cat or even hurt her by accident. I will do the same with our Goldendoodle when we get it, watch them around the dog. Plus "train" the kids to respect the dogs space.

Taking the dog to a obedience school probably will help with being around other dogs. I'm considering doing the my self. I probably can training him by my self, but want this dog to be use to other dogs. Since our Goldendoodle probably will be around other dogs in our neighborhood and family.

[Shannon and Finn]

Oh, sounds frustrating. I have seen some trainers that specifically do family training and focus on addressing aggression. Might be worth looking into training with your kids there too so they learn about ways to prevent him from growling or biting. I know it's hard because my kids want to play with Finn all the time and hug on him, Finn only tolerates it until he has had enough and the will growl to tell them to back off. Imdont see it as aggression yet because he is just telling them he doesnt like it so I am working on training my kids to give him space and let him come to them instead. I have also seen people train their dogs to go to the crate if they are feeling scared. With the walking aggression, maybe try a prong collar and work with a trainer... Good luck, I am sure you can get it worked out and keep your pup with some training. I know it's hard when you have kids and don't want to worry about them getting hurt but they are never too old for training.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Did you know that hugging a dog is an aggressive action from the dog's point of view? Many a child has been bitten because dogs don't see that as affection, it's threatening to them. Even approaching a dog head-on and reaching out at his head to pet him can be seen as an aggressive act by a dog, especially one who has not been properly socialized from birth. There are all kinds of guides and inbformation on this to help teach children how to approach and interact with dogs, and it really isn't that hard to do. They know they can't grab, hug, or reach out at other children and have to respect their spaces, so it's the same with dogs.

Here's a great article for parents: http://drsophiayin.com/blog/entry/kids-and-dogs-how-kids-should-and...

[Shannon and Finn]

I agree and can certainly see it from the dog's point of view which is why I have been working specifically with the kids on it.  I think every family with kids goes through the training period of building a harmonious relationship and setting boundaries.  Kids want to play and love and dogs do too but they have different ways of going about it.  It actually takes a lot of work (more with the kids but for the dog too).  My kids in particular were used to our first dog who gladly took hugs and all sorts of loving attention so it is a learning experience for them and the dog.  Our other dog knew to go to his own space in the laundry room when he wasn't interested and we will be teaching Finn to find his space when he is overwhelmed as well.  I am definitely not worried about us overcoming it.

Jill, I definitely think you can remedy things with some new rules and consistency so hopefully you don't feel all is lost.  It is difficult to be a parent to dogs and kids separately and even more at the same time!  For me it will be about continuing the teaching personal space and respect but it is going to take some time and carefully watching Finn to be sure he is safe until we've got it figured out.  Not sure how old your kids are, mine are 7 1/2 and 3 1/2 so there is a lot of action going on around here lately!  I also know that our previous dog always was on hyper alert when he was leashed and became very protective, especially when the kids were walking with us.  He never bit anyone or even tried but he definitely wanted to keep us close and other dogs and people away.  When he was off a leash, he was sweet as can be.

[Laurie, Fudge, and Vern]

If you private message me I can recommend two trainers that I have worked with in the York area.

[Adina P]

Aggression toward dogs and toward humans is each a separate issue.  A dog can be WONDERFUL with humans and want to eat other dogs (well not really eat, but you know what I mean).  I would not be too afraid of a dog aggressive dog, but without knowing the specific circumstances in which he has reacted  to other people and dogs it is hard to say if this is an aggressive dog or just an untrained dog in a bad situation 

[Adina P]

It would really be VERY helpful to our ability to advise you for you to respond to specifics.  Otherwise we are just shooting in the dark at what might be helpful.  Of course TRAINING is always MOST helpful no matter the issue, but training is not like programing a computer where someone puts in a code and downloads a program and 'voila' the dog is trained.  It takes a commitment to daily work and then forever maintenance (though the maintenance is not as much work as the initial time investment).  A well trained dog is A LOT of work...even the 'smart easily trained' dogs take lots of work.

[BG and Gavin]

Just repeating what others have said:  hard work, consistentcy, boundaries, committment and exercise.  Even "good" dogs need these things to be happy and secure.  Please contact a trainer in your area and get to work.