Neuter recovery & exercise

[Josh Adams]

Our 6-month-year-old Sam was neutered on Tuesday.

He bounced back quickly and is so ready to return to normal life. The poor guy has another seven days of no running, playdates, dog park, etc. per vet's orders. How do people do this? He's going NUTS. Sam is used to three hours of hard exercise each day. We're taking him on three 20-30 minute leisurely walks each day (which some websites say is too much) but that is not enough for him. By 6 PM, he's barking at the back door (something he's never done) to go out and play. He's also starting to bark at the front door as people walk by (also never done before). We finally gave in tonight and had him run around the first floor to burn off some energy. We have chew toys, puzzle games, Kongs, training/trick exercises, etc. but that does not equate to the physical stimulation he's used to and needs. I suppose there is nothing we can do but just ride it out?

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Along the lines of letting him know there's nothing to worry about, let me pass on some very good advice that I got from a trainer when I first adopted Jackdoodle. Jack was a puppy mill dog who had been relinquished to a shelter at the age of 14 months by the owner who purchased him in a pet store as a baby, and he had a LOT of fear issues. 

The trainer advised me not to use phrases like "It's okay" (accompanied by petting, hugging, coddling, etc) when he showed fear, because there is something in your voice and demeanor when you try to reassure them that way that can actually reinforce the belief that there is indeed something to worry about. Instead, she told me to be matter-of-fact, confident, and upbeat in both voice and body language, and to verbally praise him. And it did work. Later, I learned by accident that one of the best ways to stop him from being apprehensive about something was actually to laugh; not at him, but just at the situation in general. it was pretty amazing to see him visibly relax and even wag his tail just at the sound of my laughter. I guess his thought process must have been something along the lines of "Oh. She's happy. She only laughs when everything is good, so things must be fine." I'm not sure if I'm explaining this right, but it's basically an example of our emotions traveling down the leash. Does that make sense?

[Stacy]

This is exactly it! I always have crazy fun, happy parties when scary stuff like fireworks are happening. If I soothe them I make them think that they're right to be afraid. 

Another thing I struggle with personally, is trying to figure out the why. I can give you 50 reasons why Maggie does the things she does. She wasn't socialized enough, she was isolated, she was mistreated. But the why isn't really important. Dogs live in the present. They don't need to lie on the psychiatrist's couch and rehash their childhood. It's me who feels like I need to know why they do the things they do. It's more effective to work on training. Train incompatible tasks. A dog who is chewing on a toy can't bark. A dog who is trained to place can't jump on people. Training isn't just about tricks and tasks, it's about teamwork and communication. It's a lesson I'm learning, and sometimes it's easier said than done. 

That said, if I could get someone to pay for a behaviorist vs a trainer I would probably go that route too. Training and classes aren't inexpensive. So many trainers are going to private in home training, but I really like our group lessons. I feel like there is a lot of value in getting out there and meeting and greeting other people and dogs. And I learn a lot just by watching what other people do with their dogs. I think it's good to get out of our little area and do something different. 

[Josh Adams]

Great advice, Karen. What were some of the things you would say to him in a jokingly manner? 

Just now, my partner walked through the front door and Sam jumped screaming bloody hell and ran toward him. He started to wag the instant he recognized him. I laughed and said, "See, it's daddy silly". Is that a good response? 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I think so. :) 

Usually I would just laugh, or say something similar like "Isn't that silly?" and tell him he was right or he was a good boy. 

[Josh Adams]

Update: our vet saw him this morning. She does not think there's anything medically wrong with him. She suggested help from a trainer before we see a veterinary behaviorist. We found a trainer who is also a certified behaviorist (insurance will cover it) - we see her next week.

Meanwhile, the indoor barking has gotten worse. He now barks at almost every sound he hears. The poor guy will even wake up from a nap and howl. We've kept a list (and video recordings) of the noises he barks at. Interestingly, he won't bark at the noises when he hears or experiences them outside. It's just indoors.

Unfortunately, I think everything we do (or not do) is reinforcing the behavior. As our vet pointed out, when the sound goes away (example, mailman delivers mail then leaves), it rewards him because he thinks barking makes the source go away. Or when we try to stop it (whether it's laughing/shrugging it off, saying "quiet", or just calling him over to distract him), he feels rewarded because it got some sort of reaction. We obviously can't let him bark it out either. We've tried moving him to different rooms of the house, but he still hears noises and barks.

So we're very interested in what the trainer/behaviorist recommends we do. I will report back next week.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Please let us know what the trainer says.

[Josh Adams]

This may be a separate topic, but what are people's thoughts on excessive exercise and how it may relate to unwanted behavior? I've done a lot of research on Sam's barking and I came across several articles that discuss the negative impact from providing too much exercise. Patricia McConnell particularly has written a lot on the subject.

Sam gets about two and a half to three hours per day of exercise. He's only 7 months. If he doesn't get his exercise, we pay the price. As I prepare my notes for our appointment this week with the trainer/behaviorist, I'm seeing a pattern of barking when he's tired or napping. Maybe it's not connected, I'm not sure, but I wanted to throw it out there.

[Josh Adams]

Update: 

We met with the trainer and certified behaviorist regarding Sam's barking. 

Based on the videos we shared and an in-person assessment, she suspects the barking is alert/fear based barking. Though she agrees we provide plenty of exercise, she thinks he’s seeking stimulation, which common contributors include letting a dog bark or run up to people in any context, inconsistent socialization experiences, and a lack of alternative and incompatible behaviors. She also thinks our trips to the dog park has not helped him (side note: I read a great article on dog parks that has changed my opinion entirely). 

She’s provided a lot of positive reinforcement training exercises to help modify his behavior and to make his life calmer and more predictable. The first goal is for us to teach him that people, dogs, and noises are a cue to focus on us, not ignore us to pull, jump, or potentially bark. 

Since Sam has a big appetite (he still devours his food), she thinks feeding time has been a missed opportunity. She recommends we feed him using a kibble bowl to help stimulate his brain. We tried it this morning - it took him 35 minutes and he was exhausted. 

Also, to assist the training, she recommended we also use a DAP colar and a calming supplement, Zylkene or Solliquin, pending our vet’s approval. I did a search on this forum and I don't see much on DAP and almost nothing on Zylkene or Solliquin. We've sent an email to our vet, but curious on what others think of these products. 

Will post more updates on his progress. 

[Stacy]

The DAP collar did absolutely nothing for us. I've never heard of Zylkene or Solliquin. I'll have to look them up. My APDT trainer also recommended CBD oil, but I couldn't bring myself to try it. One of the CBD stores in town got shut down for having THC in their products, and I didn't want Maggie to be stoned. I don't feel like the industry is well regulated enough to be absolutely sure it's safe. 

I read your article about dog parks, and I agree with it. I think dog parks have a great place in the dog world, but it depends on the park *and* the dog. Our park is huge. It has hiking trails and it's own dog beach at the lake. I take the girls there so we can have off leash adventures together. But we almost never interact with any other dogs. We may come across someone on the trail and there may be some sniffing and maybe a few seconds of chase me this way, chase me that way, but then everyone continues moving in their own direction. And I don't encourage it. I don't prevent it, but I do call them off if anything makes me uncomfortable.

It's not like I have some magically well trained dogs, but they listen well at the park. I think they keep as close of an eye on me as I do on them. I don't socialize. I am focused on the dogs while we're there. Every once in a while I hear some not nice sounding barking, and I carefully lead us away from that. Some people do encourage their dogs to play chase in a big group in a field. We see those dogs, but my girls have never acted like they want to join in, so we just keep walking. We also don't do toys or treats at the park. Being at the park is self-rewarding.

Our area also has some parks like they describe in the article. Too small, rectangular, too many dogs, not enough for them to do. I've never been comfortable there. It's not the right environment for us. The park we go to is more like a real park, just with a little fencing and no leash rule. Maybe you will be able to find a park like that in your area. I think it would be a better experience.  

[Josh Adams]

Thanks, Stacy. Have you tried any other natural remedy? We tried Rescue Remedy once and it did nothing. Perhaps the DAP won't work for Sam either. Regardless, we're going to give it a try once our vet approves it. I’m hoping someone on the forum has experience with Zylkene or Solliquin. From what I've read, it seems effective for a lot of dogs. 

Your dog park sounds amazing. We have something like that here (not as big, maybe a 1/4 mile) but it's a madhouse. Dogs chase after one another and a lot of owners not paying attention. If Sam listened in high distracted areas as well as your pups, I would be more comfortable trying it out again. The truth is, though he’s well-behaved normally, we have a long way to go (I have to remember he's only 7 months!). Reading that article made me realize that we're not going to get anywhere in training him to listen and respond to us in high distracted areas when we go to the dog park. Even though we keep an eye on him and follow him to break up behavior we don't like, there's a lot that we miss or can't see. And I think some of that has contributed to his constant need for stimulation, which probably then led to the barking. I 100% agree with you that dog parks are great for certain dogs. I wish I read this article sooner, but better now than later. Right now, we're going to keep to our one-on-one playdates with the dogs we know and he likes. It's much more controlled, especially while we work on his barking.

[Stacy]

I did try Rescue Remedy for my tiny little papillon who had a lot of anxiety. It's 27% percent alcohol, and I used to joke about making her less anxious because she was drunk. But no, I didn't find it to have any effect. I think part of the problem is I don't have much faith in most holistic products... I think there is a placebo effect to a lot of these products, it doesn't work unless you can buy into it. Sometimes I want to believe, but I find that most people who are singing the praises and wonders of the amazing new product they've found (essential oils are a good example) are trying to sell me something. I mean no disrespect to anyone, but it hurts my feelings when someone's only interest in me is to add to their profit margin. 

Yes, Sam is very young. He's testing boundaries. I found that age to be much harder than the real puppy period. They're like teenagers. They want to see how much they can get away with. It sound like you found a good trainer. In my experience the best trainers don't have any magic tricks. It's all about consistency and repetition and boundaries. Maggie's trainer wanted me hand feeding her meals for minimum of a month. All good things come from me. And he didn't want me using any high value treats in the house. Just dog food. He said if I used the high value treats in the house how was I going to step up my game when there were real world distractions? The good news is that Sam will mature and things will be easier, and all of this time and effort you're putting into his training now will be rewarded a hundred-fold down the road. It's so rewarding to see that bond develop and to watch them understand what you're asking. 

[Josh Adams]

Stacy, sorry it took me so long to reply. Thank you for this and for reminding me he's still a baby (ok, "teenager" lol). He's become a 55-pound ball of endless energy! We didn't expect anything less for an almost 8-month-year-old, but boy, it's been hard. 

That's such good advice your trainer gave you about only using high-value treats outside. We're starting to do that now since you mentioned it. We still use some high value treats indoors to assist in the barking behavior modification. Speaking of which, I want to give an update:

It's been well over a week now since we met with the behaviorist and I'm happy to say we've noticed a difference. I would say his barking has reduced by 75%. Not sure if it's the modification techniques, switching to all meals from either frozen Kongs and/or toy dispensers, the Solliquin, or just time and patience, but it all seems to be working. Fingers crossed we continue the upward trend. We started more group classes today (outside distractions) which runs for two months and then we also start a recall class next week which runs for a month. So he'll be busy with that too. I'll keep posting updates.