SCRATCHING AND BITING AT FUR

[Mary Walker]

Since last fall around end of August when my Doodle was around 6 months old he started chewing his fur on both sides of his hind legs. My vet thought it was an allergy to rag weed and set up a treatment plan for him. When it was finished and winter approached and now during the winter he is still doing the same thing. Was wondering if anyone else out there has come across this same problem and if so what you are doing to relieve it or stop it. I have been giving him an antihistamine - 2 tablets daily..one in the morning and 12 hours later to help try to relieve the skin itching but this does not seem to be helping. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated as even the vet is at a loss as to what is wrong. Have him on a hypo allergenic food to see if that would help.

[Lynne Fowler-Oodles of Doodles]

If it is an environmental allergy, he might need tests done to determine what he is allergic to. If it is a food allergy the only way is to go to bland food and spend about 2 weeks on each to see if that might be the problem. Karen (Karen & Jack) has much more experience with this and has a discussion in The Food Group and Health and Medical Issues.

My Ginger had this same problem and through elimination and trial and error, I found that if I eliminated corn from her diet she stopped biting and itching. But that was lucky and it takes time to discover. I could be chemicals you use to clean, shampoos, any number of things he comes into contact with. Food does not make up the biggest reason for allergies.

[Mary Walker]

Lynne ..when I spoke to the breeder..he first suggested the corn..so I eliminated the food he was on that had corn in it..and still had the same problem . Put him on another type of food that had pheasant and something else...and still the same problem. Now trying a little more extensive hypo allergenic food with chicken to see if this one will work. Thank you so much for the suggestions and answering this. My groomer feels it may be the the poodle part that is making him bite his fur.
Mary Walker

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Actually, labs and goldens have a very high incidence of genetic skin problems which are allergy & itch related, much more so than poodles. Labs are the number one breed in sheer numbers for cases of atopic dermatitis.

[Sharon "Dawgma"]

Food allergies normally appear on the face first and can be sores that are crusty and itch. Sometimes they just get environmental dry scalp similar to the same thing we get. You can spend hundreds of dollars trying to find out the cause, but I start off by a good bath, rinse completely and follow with a final rinse of 50/50 mix White distilled vinegar and water and leave it in, this helps to reset the normal PH balance of the skin, helps relieve itching and I have found in 80% if not more it solves the problem. It's also one of the best natural ear washes and for treatment in the ears for yeast.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

http://doodlekisses.com/group/healthandmedicalissues/forum/topics/s...

http://doodlekisses.com/forum/topics/all-about-allergies

Mary, it would be well worth your while to read the above discussions. When I first had to deal with this, I got the same advice in the doodle forums that you are getting...baths, food, topicals, etc. With all due respect to well-meaning and caring people who are trying to help, it was extremely frustrating and less than helpful. Your doodle is suffering and you need factual information, not guesses or things to "try", some of which may actually do more harm than good. This is an immune system disease, and needs to be treated as such. And yes, it is expensive...but how much is a dog's life worth?
While the first thought that comes into everyone's mind is food allergies, these are in fact VERY RARE. Only about 10 percent of dogs exhibiting allergy symptoms such as you describe have allergies to food. Inhalant & environmental allergies are much much more common. I urge you to please read the information I have provided above...it took me 18 months to learn these things, and probably saved Jackdoodle's life.

[Mary Walker]

Karen and Jack..Thank you so much for providing me with all this information. When this first occurred it was late August and my vet assumed he was suffering from rag weed. At that time he put him on pills that made him very hungry and thirsty all the time.. I'm sorry but I didn't write the name of the medication down but was so upset when this happened and nothing good came out of it and a month later he was still biting at his fur.
The main areas where he bites his hair off down to his skin is on his back hind legs up around the flank area.
He doesn't go to the point of biting himself raw where it is bleeding but it does make it look bad especially when his hair is long and he has these totally bald spots on his hind quarters. The only areas so far.
I talked to his groomer and she uses an oatmeal based product to wash him but he does seem to be more itchy after he comes from having a bath. So reading what you have said..it is better to leave the bath part out as he doesn't get dirty so really just taking him once a month to get his nails and ears done as well but I have taken over the job of seeing that the little hair in his ears are taken care of by me now.
So more baths are not good is what I am understanding from what you have written to me.??
I put him on antihistamines myself to see if this would control some of the itching and biting. It really does not help but possibly would be worse without taking them and not sure he is on the right amount for his weight. He weighs 19 pounds and I give him 2 pills per day spread out and each caplet contains 25 mg of Diphenhydramine Hydrochloride.
When this started ,I did call the breeder where I bought him to find out if any of their dogs had any kind of a similar allergy and they did say that one puppy from another litter had experienced a similar reaction, but to make sure that whatever I was feeding him did not have a corn product in it.
So at that time I took him off the food he was eating and put him on a hypo allergenic one that did not have corn in it and the protein was pheasant and I believe duck..
Since he is almost finished that bag since he only eats a little over a cup per day, it does take quit a while to finish the smallest bag but I do remove the food and put it in an air tight container. I do not leave it in the original bag.
Now I have just purchased a grade up. It is put out by Hill's and is a Prescription Diet...Z/D - Ultra Allergen- Free.
Some of the ingredients are Starch, Hrdrolyzed Chicken, Liver, Soybean Oil and of course a whole slew of vitamins.
They did tell me there is another food up from this with Kangaroo meat that they can order in for me.
So with all of this information..would you suggest some kind of testing if this particular food does not relieve any of the symtoms and would you recommend the fish oil capsules on his food.??
If he still remains biting and itching after this food what would be the first thing I should try to find out what he might be allergic to and where would I go to find out.??
Thank you so very much for the sites you posted in your answer. I have read them and just need a little more guidance to make my life and Bailey's much better.
Thanking you in advance for all your help.
Mary Walker

[Janie]

Mary, my advice is you should really listen to Kare and Jack...she knows what she is talking about. Your dog is surley suffering...poor thing. I know it has to be hard on you to see him go through this.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Mary, you can do better than the Rx hill's food...it is expensive, and contains soy, which is one of the more likely allergens...provided that he is allergic to food, which is not likely. I would not call that a step up. There was probably nothing wrong with the pheasant food. Make sure that whatever food you use has no corn, wheat, or soy in it. Beef is the most likely protein to cause an allergy, next would be chicken. Lamb, duck, pheasant, fish, venison, are all fine. But again, it's probably not the food. 6 months is really too young to have developed food allergies.
The drug the vet gave you in August was steroids...probably prednisone. This is something that you want to avoid, if possible. It should be used sparingly, only in situations where the dog needs relief from severe allergic reactions. It will not cure anything, nothing will cure allergies.
Bailey may very well be allergic to ragweed, and there may be other substances that he is also allergic to. The only way you will know for sure is to do the testing Jack had. Ragweed is unavoidable. But he may not be allergic to anything. There are any number of parasites and parasitic diseases that can cause these symptoms, and a good vet will eliminate those possibilities first. Did they do skin scrapings? if not, insist that they do. It can be mites.
Bathing should be kept to a minimum, not more than once every 6-8 weeks. you can "spot clean" areas that need attention in between. Brush him a lot, it will feel good & help distribute the natural oils in his coat. Make sure Bailey's feet are kept dry & free of grass, etc.
Many different antihistamines can be used, different dogs do better on different ones. The diphenhydramine will make him sleepy, I would ask the vet for the proper dosage of loratidine, atarax, or one of the others. JD weighs over 80lbs, so I'm not comfortable recommending a dosage for Bailey. Fish oil capsules can help. You could also try 500 mg capsules of evening primrose oil, that's what works best for Jack, but again, I'm not sure about dosage for Bailey. I would check with the vet again about all of this.
Good luck & please keep us posted.