What Do We Do About Breeder Complaints?

[Adina P]

As you know we only permit breeder recommendations in designated areas, however we have no rules or guidelines about complaints about breeders.  Now and then members post gripes and complaints about breeders they openly name.  This causes stress for the breeder who MAY be wrongly accused...but in either case it is not consistent with our policy on praising breeders.  I am not a fan of excessive moderation and I'd like our site rules to determine what is permitted not my personal judgement about what I think is fair/unfair.  Rule of Law not law of the ruler ... That's what I prefer.  So what do you think?  On the one hand it's good and useful to know if a breeder is not so reputable...on the other hand there are two sides to any story and who really wants to have to come and defend their program on a public forum where things could get ugly.  We are not a courtroom.

Share your thoughts on what a good policy on this is.  What is fair to both breeders and potential buyers?  I don't want to be the clearinghouse of complaints either.

Speak your minds please. 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I don't think it's fair to allow public complaints about a breeder if we don't allow public praise, referrals or recommendations for a breeder. But I really like our current policy on breeder recommendations, advertising, etc. I think we are the absolute best doodle website in existence in the way we attempt to educate potential doodle owners on responsible breeding practices and what to look for in a breeder. So as to maintain fairness and not to change that for the worse, it seems only fair that breeders should not be named in complaints in the open forum, either.
People can tell their stories without naming the breeder. It isn't all that hard to figure out where a particular dog came from, and people can always communicate with each other privately if they have "inquiring minds".
I have managed to make breeder recommendations and/or referrals, as well as warnings, privately and quite easily.

[April Cliber]

I completely agree! Well said! Thanks for saving me the time of typing that out. :o) You read my mind!

[F, Calla & Luca]

This is really a sticky topic. Because both your "hands" are valid points. I do think it's worked without much oversight to date. Members question the complainer about the validity of the complaints and/or concur with them. Nobody wants to defend their program but they should be able to if necessary. It would be really a biased selection if only positive views were allowed. There would be no way to know if some breeders were just not mentioned by chance or if some members had bad experiences with them. We should of course praise good breeders but likewise, I think we should be able to write about bad breeders. Both my dogs came from distant breeders but I was unable to recommend them because I had not visited their programs. I wouldn't want anyone to think I might have had bad experiences simply because of a lack of mention, by me a least, in the owner recommended group.

Now I'm wondering if I missed a recent post involving a complaint about a breeder. Maybe it would help to explain somewhere that puppies from good programs can get giardia or coccidia, etc. I's partly the way it's handled that distinguishes a good from a bad breeder. I know we have "What to look for in a breeder " advice. Do we have similar informaton about what to avoid?

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I think what to avoid is part of "what to look for".

[F, Calla & Luca]

Oh, good, I'll go look. I haven't been in the market for a pup lately. Just checked and you're right.

[Joanne ~ Spud*]

This may/may not work.

On a members page, in the profile area, a person can select--Would you recommend your breeder Yes x NO x. Positive and Negative Information by Private Email Only and Strictly Enforced. Or something to this effect. This way, someone feels they have a voice but it is not displayed out in the open. A link to the rules would also show up it someone would like to use this option on their profile.
I would love to Redirect Everyone Away from Spud's Breeder. He is a great dog but I would never go there again. I've only been asked a few times but I knew to take it privately.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Actually, there is nothing preventing a DK member from mentioning where they got their doodle right on their profile. In the "Tell us about your doodle" section, anyone is free to say "Gigi is an F1B goldendoodle from So-and-so breeder." I have seen many people who've done this on their pages and also mentioned that the breeder waqs great to work with, etc.

[Joanne ~ Spud*]

I've also seen this on profiles. Giving an area specifically for this purpose may give a person a chance to quietly complain about a horrible situation without it blasted in a public discussion.

Personally, I would NOT use this option, but I know of one local woman who SHOULD be able to voice her opinion about a very sick puppy and warn others to stay away from a breeder but can't and won't in the open but she will privately. How do we handle that?

With more and more fast buck / fly by night situations we may need to find a solution to this problem.

[F, Calla & Luca]

But there is no way someone looking for a puppy would necessarily be able to track this down. I have the names of my breeders on my page but although other references to them involving me came up in a search my page did not.

[Joanne ~ Spud*]

Personally, I hate the Breeder Complaint Discussions. I have seen a very nice one in a Area Group. It is an on going discussion but seems CIVIL ( imagine that ) and constructive, and also very fact finding. This is the Ideal Situation and rarely found out in the open areas.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

There are plenty of "review" sites all over the internet where people can either praise or damn anything from a pair of shoes to a dog breeder. I don't see why advertising or promoting a particular breeder is necessary here. What is gained by it? Most people think their breeders are great, unless they have a problem. Recently, someone asked for breeder recommendations in the forum, and before Adina could intervene, one person recommended a known puppy mill broker. So recommendations aren't really very helpful.
A truly bad breeder deserves to be "outed", but again, why here? I agree that it would be very unpleasant to have DK become a clearinghouse for grievances or a courtroom. If someone wants the information, there are all kinds of ways to get it. These things tend to make themselves known. I think there needs to be a very compelling reason to open this can of worms.

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

I would rather not see breeders named in complaints on the public forum. If there are problems with a Doodle due to poor breeding practices, I think it's fine for someone to discuss it, without naming the breeder. That specific information can be shared with others via private message, if desired.