Immunization

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

I just posted this as a discussion on the main page....Karen suggested that I cross-post here, so here goes...

I'm reading a book called "Scared Poopless" by Jan Rasmusen that I'm finding so informative. I think to lots of people it would be really provocative, but since we're all had the benefit of Karen's informed input in the Food Group and some great insights from those in the Health and Medical Issues Group, lots of this wasn't actually "revolutionary news" to me.....but confirmed what I've been learning here.  What was especially helpful was the information provided on Immunization.  I really never felt like I got a truly straight answer from my vet on this and I've had lots of uncertainty every time one of my guys got vaccinated.

I wanted to share a few of the key points that I picked up.  I'm sure not everyone will agree with all of this and I think some of it is over the top, but I was able to get a few questions answered....at least in my own mind. 

-For many years it was the vaccine manufacturers who dictated what vaccines should be given and how often....not vets.  Hmmmm I think we're heard something similar when it comes to RX food.  As more vaccines started popping up for more and more diseases, some vets became concerned and  the American Animal Hospital Association formed a task force in 2003 to study this issue and make recommendations. Lots of vague results from this task force..."no vaccine is always safe, no vaccine is always protective, and no vaccine is always indicated".  But what did happen is the American College of Veterinary Internal Medicine endorse these guidelines and most vet schools moved to a core/non-core approach.

-The AAHA recommendations are....Distemper, parvovirus and adenovirus 2 (core vaccines) are highly recommended.  Rabies vaccine should be given ad directed by law.  Non-core vaccines which prevent against short-lived or easily treated diseases should be given only when specifically indicated by geography or lifestyle.  These include bordetella, parainfluenza, leptospirosis, Lyme, and distemper-measles (at risk puppies only). Generally NOT recommended include coronavirus, giardia lamblia, and adenovirus 1.

-According to the AAHA there is "strong and growing consensus among immunology and infectious disease experts that annual vaccination is neither necessary nor advisable".  There is apparently a great deal of evidence that some dogs actually develop a lifetime immunity (or at least several years) from their first vaccination.  There's only one way to know for sure and that's titer testing.  I have definitely decided that there will be no more "boosters" for my guys without titers first.

-The book provides a list of conditions that place a dog at high risk for reactions.  There are actually some breeds more susceptible than others.

-Bad reactions to modified live virus vaccines (distemper, parvo, adenovirus2) generally happen within 10 to 45 days and include achy joints, nervous system disorders, elevated liver enzymes, liver or kidney failure, and autoimmune problems. Killed virus vaccines like rabies, bordetella, and lepto add lots of "stuff" to boost their effectiveness, so they also can cause bad reactions.  These reactions usually appear immediately or within a day or two and include seizures, lameness, allergies, arthritis, and even anaphylactic shock.

-The safest vaccines are monovalent (containing a single virus) or bivalent (two viruses).  Outside of a lab no dog would ever encounter four to seven diseases at the same time, yet many times dogs are being vaccinated for multiple diseases at once.

-Vaccine manufactures work off a "one size fits all" model.  Currently a 5 lb dog and a 140 lb dog are getting the same vaccine.  You can ask your vet to split or "titrate" a vaccine (except for rabies which can't be legally titrated) for your smaller dog.  I will be doing this for Guinness.

-Here are some questions to consider when deciding about non-core vaccines...

Does your location or lifestyle put your dog at high risk of serious damage or death from this disease?

How many cases has your vet seen in the past year?

Is there an alternative?

Is now the best time to vaccinate?

Does the vaccine protect against the most common stains and types?

Do possible adverse reactions outweigh benefits?

Has your vet had experience with the vaccine?  How many adverse reactions has she seen from your breed?

Does the vet school near you recommend it?I will definitely be questioning my vet going forward before just agreeing to "boosters".  I know she initially thought I was a "crazy Doodle Mom" when I started really pushing her regarding her dog food recommendations...and she now feels very differently about it.  This will solidify my "crazy" status.  Maybe we'll both learn something.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Thanks, Jane. This will be a good refernce when someone does a search here for vaccinations.

[Nancie & Gracie Doodle]

We just took Gracie Doodle to a new alternate vet.  Basically to see if we were doing everything we could for her.  It is more the holistic type.  I saw the book on the bookshelf there.  I was alerted earlier a few months ago here on DK when one of our members posted about her new vet that addressed the vaccines as being over used.  Both our regular vet and this new one agree that the vaccines are not necessary and are willing to write the letter necessary when her rabies license comes do to have her waived from the vaccine and still get her registration.  We now are no longer going to give Gracie any of the boosters or vaccines in the future.  Glad to know more people are finding out about it.  

[Nugget's Family]

Great summary!  Thanks so much!  I esp liked the point about the "one size fits all" vaccine for dogs of all sizes.  That has never made sense to me.

Thanks again!

Susan

[Jill, Woody & Maxi]

Thank you for posting this..a very good reference! It doesnt make sense that a 5lb/140 lb dog get the same dosage vaccine...and it is a shame that we feel "crazy" when we are just being cautious.. I remember last year for vaccinations, my vet looked at me like I had 5 heads when I asked if the vaccines could be split up over a period of time....