Need Help...The Fighting has Reached an all Time High

[Amy, Cubbie & Ollie]

*also posted in main forum, but i'm desperate for help*

The fighting has increased and I just don’t know what to do.  I am 2,000 miles away from home and my two doodles and I feel completely helpless and worried.  I am looking for any suggestions.  I apologize for the length of this post. 

 

Here is a little background:

We had Cubbie for about 3 years when we adopted Ollie in 2011.  From day one, we struggled with issues between the 2 dogs.  We trained Ollie separately (Cubbie already had his CGC) and we also took both dogs to a training class together.  Ollie now has his CGC, so both dogs have been through a decent amount of training.  We worked with our trainer and finally got to a point where we weren’t constantly worried about a fight breaking out.  We were able to go 1-2 months between incidents, which was actually a big improvement, when suddenly things started getting worse.

 

In August I got a new job that requires us to move 2,000 miles away.  My DH has to stay back in Indiana for the remainder of the year (he is a teacher) while I move to WA.  In the month before I moved, I was super stressed and very busy trying to get the house ready to sell and say all my good-byes.  That is when things started to get a little worse with the dogs.  They seemed to get more easily aggravated with each other but I just assumed that they were reacting to my high stress levels.

 

Once I left for WA, DH didn’t have any issues for the first 2.5 weeks.  Everything seemed like it was back to normal.  Then I came home for a 2 day stay before departing for the doodle cruise.  The first night I was home I was sitting on the couch holding Ollie and when Cubbie simply walked past, Ollie growled at him.  So I put Ollie in another room to prevent the situation from escalating.  Once I let Ollie back out, he went and laid down on the kitchen floor, but Cubbie just stood there staring at him and you could tell that the tension was rising again.  So they were back in separate rooms.  The whole time I was gone on the cruise, the dogs were mostly ok. 

 

I returned from the cruise on Saturday afternoon.  Saturday evening we had a HUGE fight.  My husband and I were sitting on the couch watching tv.  Ollie was chewing on a bone and then the next thing we know they were attacking each other.  We didn’t see what happened so we don’t know who/what started it.  They were rolling around, teeth flashing, growling, and snarling.  Cubbie had Ollie pinned and was tearing at his ear.  Ollie was screaming (or the doggie equivalent).  I used an air horn until it ran out and that didn’t stop them.  I threw a pillow at them and still nothing.  I finally grabbed Cubbie by the back legs and lifted up and tried to pull him off Ollie.   When I finally pulled them apart, I stood there holding Cubbie up at chest level to keep them away from each other.  Ollie jumped up to try to get Cubbie and got my arm instead.  That was over a week ago and I still have a rather large bruise on my arm.  We kept them apart the rest of the night and then most of Sunday too.  The only time they were together on Sunday was when we took them both on a long walk while we had a showing on the house.

 

Yesterday DH had to separate them again because they were getting tense with each other.  But tonight was the worst.  DH called me at work and said “if we don’t do something about these dogs they are going to kill each other.”  Needless to say, I wasn’t really able to focus on work for the rest of the day.  Apparently Ollie had been laying on the couch and Cubbie was standing near the couch.  Nothing had been going on.  No toys were involved.  All of a sudden, Cubbie jumped up and started to attack Ollie.  DH said that Ollie tried to get away twice but Cubbie just kept going after him.  I am not sure what all DH tried, but he said that eventually he was able to get Cubbie off Ollie by swatting him with a pillow to get them to stop long enough to step between them and then used the pillow to herd Cubbie into another room.  I told him to keep them separate for the rest of the night, to take them out to potty individually, and make them sleep in separate rooms instead of the bedroom with him.  He is going to let them out in the morning individually and then put them in separate rooms to feed them breakfast and then leave in separate rooms when he goes to work.  My parents are going to go over in the middle of the day to let each dog out separately.  I am so stressed out; I just don’t know what to do. 

 

At first I thought they just might be feeding off my stress, but I’m not there now.  We moved their beds into storage and put up most of their toys so our house doesn’t look as “doggie” when potential home buyers come in for a showing.  There are strange people leaving strange smells in our home.  I was gone, then I came home, then I was gone, then I came home, then I was gone.  Are they just stressed out and confused?  DH and my brother will be driving the dogs out to WA starting on 10/25 where I will be living with them in temporary housing (a 1 or 2 bedroom apartment) until our house is done in December?  Am I going to make it?  I will take any advice or suggestions that anyone can possibly offer.

[Ginny Nightingale]

OY-- what a stressful situation for all of you!!! First thing I will say is get a big spray bottle with a stream setting and fill it with water--keep it around and give them a squirt right in the face when they even show that they are getting growly--it really does subdue them and eventually, you might just need to point the water bottle and they will stop. Of course, you should say "NO" or "No growl! when you spray. The water bottle will work during the fight too--it startles them. And do not pick up a dog when there is a fight--as you have learned, it makes you and the dog a victim. Just lead them by the collar out of the room. 

 I have one dog out of three who rules the roost and he will occasionally growl at the others to get something they have, but the other two female dogs will let him have it every time, so no fights--sounds like you have two dogs who will not back down and are fighting over the alpha position--even when there are no toys or bones, they are fighting over you or DH--was he on the couch when Cubbie attacked Ollie on the couch? Or it may even just be the couch!

You will not change this behavior in my opinion, because they are both "hard-wired" to be alphas--BUT that doesn't mean you have to get rid of one dog or keep them separated all the time. You just have to come up with something that you can do to stop it before it starts that they respect, like the water bottle perhaps. And then, take precautions when you have a situation that might lead to fights--for example, when bones are around, use a gate to separate them. And NO dogs on the furniture, means they can't fight over that. 

One of my dogs is at the bottom of the totem pole here and when I hand out treats like a cow hoof, she "asks" to go to the other side of the gate that blocks my dogs from the living room so that she can chew on her hoof without a threat from the alpha--I open the gate and she runs thru and relaxes with her hoof in the living room--problem solved!!

[Amy, Cubbie & Ollie]

Thanks Ginny.  I will have to try the water bottle thing.  We tried it on Cubbie for barking, but it didn't have much impact but maybe it will be more effective for stopping a fight. 

We usually try to herd Cubbie into another room using a pillow or other object to block his line of vision to Ollie once they have gotten into a fight.  We can't lead them by their collars because they don't wear collars in the house. 

Do you keep your dogs off the furniture?  How do you keep them off when you aren't home or does it not matter unless you are there? 

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

 When we got Clancy, two of our three other dogs immediately told him where he was in the hierarchy.  Our anxious Springer and Clancy took a few months to settle into a truce; we were able to stop arguments because we kept them separated when we weren't there.  Our settling-in was minor compared to yours and I know that you have worked very hard to solve this  so I don't really have any solutions to offer.  I admire how hard you have worked and think that perhaps the current problems are due to the stress and changes in their lives.  The only thing I can think of for this dificult time would be for you to keep one dog and your dh the other.

[Amy, Cubbie & Ollie]

Thanks Nancy.