Controlling, "Owning", and Confidence

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

I had a pretty interesting conversation with our trainer yesterday.  I wanted to share it and get your thoughts.  This week we've been taking G & M to the park to practice off leash recalls.  I'm trying to get Murph's recall to be faster because of flyball.  He's very consistent, but he's just not running back to me at full speed.  The grass at the park was full of goose poop popsicles, which provided a great distraction.  We're also using Guinness to teach Murph about "waiting for his turn".  I put him in a sit/stay and we throw the ball for Guinness who retrieves and returns it.  Murph has to sit calmly and not react....until it's his turn.  He shakes and cries, but he does it.  Where we're doing this is in the soccer field which adjoins the parking lot where people are getting in and out of their cars to walk their dogs along the path.  Every time I saw a car pull up with a dog, I ran and leashed Murph.  Obviously I was anticipating a "reaction" to the other dog.  After doing it several times, my trainer asked me why I thought it was necessary to get him on leash (and then hold onto him like he would "bolt").  I said, "well I have to have control over him because of the other dogs".  There's the "control" word.  He asked what do you think would happen if you just calmly put him in a down/stay as these dogs were exiting the cars.  I just laughed and said that I was pretty sure he'll go after the dog.  He completely disagreed with that.  So we tried it as the next car pulled up.  He put him in a down/stay and we just watched.  Well he never even moved....the other dog got out of the car barking and Murph just watched.  We talked a lot about this (in the freezing cold).  He explained to me that because of my lack of confidence in Murphy, I was ALWAYS trying to control him.  He said he sees it in how I interact with him, and especially how I walk him.  He really feels that this is holding him back.  He said if I can be confident enough to feel like I'm "owning" the situation, and believe that Murph WILL do what I tell him to I will be able to finally have the kind of "two way" relationship that is key to our moving forward. Our training will not be successful until I reach the point where I'm not always ready to physically restrain Murph versus trusting that he will make the right choice.  What do you think?

[Connie & Kramer]

This is a great post.  Are there places you can go that have dogs but not moving cars.  I think it will help build your level of trust in Murph.  If it was me, I would be worried about the cars.  Even though I only have a 4 1/2 old pup, I do understand this.  I've been letting Kramer out of the house without a leash for a few weeks to do his business in the yard, play fetch, and otherwise get that puppy energy expended before he gets into his crate.   We don't have a fence (urban/suburban neighborhood) so I was really nervous about letting him out. This was a great trust building exercise for both of us because I am testing if he will listen to me and he is testing me to see what he is allowed to do.  It's working great in our somewhat controlled environment.  I suppose when we reach the level you are at in training, it will help me have more confidence that he will do what I ask.  Good luck to you! Sounds like you are doing a wonderful job with your doodles!

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

Thanks, Connie.  It's not the cars that I worry about...it's the other dogs.  Murph has a strong recall, but he is dog reactive, so I'm always worried that he will go after another dog when I can't control him with the leash.  Interestingly enough, he never has gone after another dog when he's been off leash....only when we're on a walk and I do have him leashed.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I think it's very hard to always trust that any dog will always make the right choice. After all you've been through with Murph, two (or ten) steps forward and then a step back, it's natural that you would have trouble just believing that he is not going to surprise you in any given situation. Erring on the side of caution, which is what you're doing when you restrain him, is IMO a better choice than erring the other way. I think that trust has to be earned, and there's no doubt in my mind that you have certainly developed a greater trust in Murph as you have worked together. I think that will continue to increase naturally. You certainly can't force yourself to trust him (or anybody else, lol) in every situation.

I also don't think it's fair to say "Our training will not be successful until...". Your training is a work in progress, and success in training is not an absolute. You already have been successful in accomplishing many of the goals you've had for Murphy. I don't think anyone can ever sit back and say "Okay, now our training is successful."

Maybe we could change that to "our training will not be as successful as it could be until...". What do you think, lol?

[F, Calla & Luca]

These sound like good points to me Karen.

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

They ARE good points, Karen.  I think Ben feels like HE's not being successful with me until I reach the point where I can calmly and confidently handle Murphy with an internal belief that I am a good enough trainer to manage any situation...without having a "stronghold" on his collar or leash, and not with MY body ready to react to constrain him at all times.  He kind of has this vision of watching me walk Murphy where I just look relaxed and confident, with no tension.  That's when he says we'll know that I no longer need him.  Even when we have great walks and even when I take Murph to Flyball, there is no question that I'm far from relaxed...I'm watching his every move and constantly ready for him to react.  The Daycare owner who is has put together the Flyball class has commented to me about the same thing.

[Adina P]

You need to cut yourself some slack.  This is the first dog you've spent this much time training...nobody is a high level trainer right off.  Murphy is breaking you in and taking you to levels you never thought  you'd master.  But that doesn't mean you're done learning and improving.  It might be a future dog that 'completes' your training =)

And I agree that trust has to be earned.  Perhaps you and Ben can do more of this type of practice where he is off leash or at least on a very light line near dogs for stays, etc.  It's that darn fine line (I don't have it down)between being able to read your dog and being prepared to respond but NOT anticipating problems before they are there or expecting the worst all the time.

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

Adina, YOU are a confident trainer.  I could see it in those videos you posted.  How did you gain that?

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

Oh, and there will be no "future dogs".

[F, Calla & Luca]

This just caught my attention Jane. I am not one of the intensive dog trainers as you may have gathered. Luca and Calla are my first truly my own dogs. And it makes me so sad that they are probably my last. But if they live long lives, which I hope they do, I don't know if I could ever get another dog when they die if in fact I outlive them. Because a future dog would likely outlive me or my ability to care for it. But you are younger than I am and I wonder about your statement about future dogs. Perhaps this isn't the place to discuss this, though.

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

If the boys live 10 more years, I would be 75 at that point.  I just don't see myself starting out with a new dog at that age.  I think there are a lot of things after that age that COULD physically render me incapable of caring for a dog.  I would not want a dog to get attached to me and then have to be rehomed....it wouldn't be fair.  So I think we're in exactly the same place, F.  I feel so fortunate that I have Guinness and Murphy at this stage of my life....they will be enough.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Jane, Guinness could easily have another 14 years. It's not at all unusual for miniature poodles to live to be 17 and even older.

How about getting another dog at 80, lol?

 

[F, Calla & Luca]

My thinking exactly. But life will be so sad it makes me tear up thinking about it. I happened to look back at childhood pictures last night digging something out for a cousin's 70th. So many pictures of when I was a kid show me holding a chicken, feeding baby animals at the Catskill Game farm etc. I guess I really did always love animals. I remember begging my parents for a dog. I guess they didn't believe I could care for it and that an apartment in NYC was the proper venue.