Adult Dog Peeing in Sleep??? .... And Recent Coat Changes

[Stella]

My Chase is 4 years old, he is a neutered male.  On a couple of occasions recently I have noticed that he has peed in his sleep.  Not a whole pee, just a small amount.  Has anyone else had this happen with their doodle?  I did a search but all the other discussions seemed to refer to puppies.

Also, he is a multigen non-shedding doodle with a mostly curly coat.  I have noticed recently that he has got patches where his coat has gotten really thin and wispy, you can almost see his skin through and his skin appears to be quite dry.  (We do heat with wood in the wnter which does dry your skin out).  But, I find it strange that this is only occuring in patches.  Any ideas??

I don't know if this coat change is related to his peeing in his sleep or not, but thought I'd mention it anyway.

Thanks guys.

[Sherri, Sophie, Winston, & Kitty]

I bought cranberry capsules at the pharmacy and sprinkled them in Sophie's food.  I have no idea how much this helped but it didn't hurt...

[Stella]

Ok, a bit of an update.  I took the insurance form for the vet to fill in, and when I picked them up she had kindly included a copy of his vet notes! 

The bloodwork included a T4 test, which I am assuming is the thyroid?  He scored 18.7 which looks like it is on the low side of normal (7.7 - 47.6 according to the printout!).  Everything else was pretty well within normal limits except for Alkaline Phosphate which was off the chart low, he scored 18 (normal 24-141), but I don't know what the significance of that is, if anything.  She told us his bloodwork was essentially normal and nothing to worry about.  Cortisol wasn't listed in the results which I know can be an indicator for Cushings, which is disappointing.  In her notes it indicates that further testing could include adrenal metabolite profile, so I am disappointed that this wasn't done already.  She suggested we just monitor his skin/ hair condition for now and see if it improves without intervention.

My husband was deeply offended when the Vet Tech doing the catheterisation for the second urine sample commented that Chase has a very small penis!!  I think DH took it personally!!

The food she was recommending was Royal Canin Urinary S/O canned food. Essentially, she was saying we need to increase his water intake and that a canned food would be better than kibble.  Her other suggestion was to add water to his kibble.  Here are the ingredients for the Urinary S/O:

Water Sufficient for Processing, Chicken Liver, Corn Grits, Pork By-Product, Chicken, Chicken By-Product, Modified Corn Starch, Vegetable Oil, Powdered Cellulose, Natural Flavour, Sodium Tripolyphosphate, Guar Gum, Potassium Chloride, Fish Oil, Carob Gum, Salt, Carrageenan, Calcium Sulphate, Taurine, DL- Methionine, Calcium Carbonate, Choline Chloride, Potassium Phosphate, Vitamins (DL-Alpha-Tocopherol Acetate [Source of Vitamin E], Biotin, Thiamine Mononitrate [Vitamin B1], Niacin Supplement, D-Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Supplement [Vitamin B2], Pyridoxine Hydrochloride [Vitamin B6], Vitamin B12 Supplement, Folic Acid and Vitamin D3 Supplement), Trace Minerals (Zinc Oxide, Iron Sulphate, Zinc Proteinate, Copper Sulphate, Manganous Oxide, Sodium Selenite and Calcium Iodate), Magnesium Oxide and Marigold Extract (Source of Lutein). Approximately 480 kcal/can, 385 g/can

I highlighted two very good reasons why I would never ever feed this to my dogs!  And, I'm not an expert, but what is there in that food that would help with decreasing crystals in the urine??  Honestly though, I think every time DH takes the dogs to the vet without me I should request a copy of the vet notes so I can make sure I get the whole story!!

So, we will continue with the antibiotics, natural yogurt for his digestive health (thanks Karen), and EPO for his skin.  I have bought some Wild Salmon Oil to add in on alternate days in the evening (they get EPO in the mornings) and I also bought Cranberry capsules!!  Should I wait until the antibiotics have finished before starting the cranberry capsules, or do you think I can start them right away??

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I'd start the cranberry capsules now. Just give it away from the antibiotics, same with the yogurt.

It's disappointing that they didn't do a full thyroid panel, and full blood work, which needs to be sent out. Testing just T4 can be very misleading. In order to really diagnose anything, they really need to look at all of the thyroid values.

There's more than just the by-products wrong with this food. Corn grits as the 2nd ingredient (I'm not going to count water) and then corn starch after the by-products, unnamed vegetable oil (you don't suppose it could be corn, do you?) and unnamed fish oil, carageenan, all are things I would not want my dog to consume. 

And what a lame excuse. Canned food would be better than kibble. I'll buy that, canned foods are high in moisture content and might be better, but the store is full of high-quality canned foods that don't contain by-products and corn. 

I hope that Chase gets better soon and no further testing is necessary. 

[BG and Gavin]

LOL about the small penis story!  Maybe Chance was just cold :) 

[Stella]

Yep, poor little fella - the indignity of being poked and prodded and then a catheter inserted would make any guys penis shrink!  The funniest part was how upset my DH was about the comments, you'd think someone had told him he has a small penis!  Chase is neutered, so he has no use for it anyway!!

[F, Calla & Luca]

I would not worry a bit about the Alkaline Phosphatase. It is unlikely that the thyroid function is abnormal although there are some thyroid conditions where further testing would be warranted. Because of the variability of cortisol in blood a 24 hour urine test is more often used in humans, not an easy task in dogs. Exercise and eating , time of day may affect cortisol. I think your vet is proceeding with reason. Testing for everything is very costly and so tests should not be over ordered. Part of the reasons that health care costs for people and pets is due to using tests more often than needed.

Luca has a small penis, which is, I think, due to early neutering. He doesn't care a bit.

[Stella]

I figured the penis shrinkage may also be due to the fact that she was tryng to stick a catheter up there!! 

F. I know what you mean about the testing, what we did get done added up to almost $800 - just to find out in the end he has a UTI, and no answer for the hair loss.  If I got paid for the amount of times I have to explain to a client why they don't need to be referred for an x-ray or an MRI, I'd be a rich woman!!

[F, Calla & Luca]

Just what I mean.

[Sue, Murphy and Bella ()*o*()]

Oh gosh, the small penis syndrome!!!! Murphy never has had a penis, hardly a bump. Never see it, never worry about the red lipstick popping out when company is over. I'll take a small penis on my dogs any day!

[Sue, Murphy and Bella ()*o*()]

Glad to hear you have a diagnosis and treatment plan. I hope you have pet insurance though. That's a hefty bill. And the antibiotics were probably included in there, but you do know you can ask for a prescription and go to any pharmacy for most medications, especially antibiotics?
A lot of the meds are used for humans too. For instance, prednisone, same stuff for dogs or humans. About 1/4 of the price at the pharmacy rather than the vet.
In my experience anyway. Karen might have more research and experience about this though.

[F, Calla & Luca]

I believe you are right. Generic medications are much cheaper than at the vet. I remember the time I got a few pills for Rex at the vet, intending to get the rest elsewhere. They charged me $10 to fill the prescription at the vet's office.

[Sue, Murphy and Bella ()*o*()]

I wonder how many vets are willing to write scripts for their patients to get drugs elsewhere though. Mine is very nice about it, but then she and her techs don't try to push RX foods on me either.