Advice Regarding Breeder Consideration

[Jeanette Clark]

First - I'm not asking for info or references for a specific breeder.

Let me explain -

We're not new to doodles, per se.  We haven't owned one, but have been following threads and talking to breeders and owners and trying to educate ourselves about the breed and breeders for over a year.  We lost our family dog (a wonderful golden) of 11 years to cancer a bit over a year ago - and it was truly one of the most difficult things we have been through.  We knew we would want another dog as part of our family - but we needed time to heal. 

We would like to think that we have been dilligent in selecting breeders to talk to, and based on talking with the breeders and communicating with them, chose wisely in the ones we continue to maintain a relationship with until we felt as a family we were ready to have another dog. 

Now that time has come, we have expanded some of our breeder search as the specific size and color we prefer has not been common, and the few breeders we have built a relationship won't be including those in their breeding program until next spring/summer - if at all.

As we expanded our search, we found what appeared to be a great candidate breeder.  We found good references/referral information on the web.  We believe we found current owners actively supporting the breeder on forums.  The information researched included details on the appropriate health testing, warranty/contract, etc.

The issue that has raised concern is that I have been unable to actually talk to this breeder.  I emailed, I filled out their online form, and left voice mail messages - all went unanswered for a few days.  I left a follow up voice mail communicating that perhaps there had been a technical issue with their web site - and later that day, had 2 emails back and a voice mail - all inviting me to look up info on their site, as well as call her back to discuss my questions/interests. 

So I did - to only get voice mail.  And despite trying to communicate a sense of urgency of needing to talk with them, I have not heard back (I left the voice mail and additional email yesterday).

I fully understand that we have lots of activities and commitments we are trying to balance - that despite the best of intentions, some times things just come up - but I guess I have a slighly less acceptance to that when it somes to business and financial dealings (in that, when there is money, or the potential to have money invovled, I have slightly different expectations, regardless of the amount).

In comparison, another breeder, that might have an alternate for us to consider (depending on current picks, etc.) has been in almost immediate communication with every email or call we have made - to both emails first thing in the morning, as well as in the late evening.  Great customer service in that regards - but unfortunately, the puppies aren't our first choice in size/color, close...but not our first choice.

Here's the request for advice - Am I reading too much into the delay/lack of communication/response?  Is this a warning sign regarding the involement of this breeder with thier adoption families (and potential support or issue resolution)?

Thank you!  Not hearing back is driving me crazy...and I don't know if I should just give up and move on to working with a different breeder or not.  We want to do as much screening up front as we can, before a visit - as once we see puppies, we know emotionally it will be hard to walk away without one....

 

 

[Maryann,Roo and Tigger]

I would draw a line through this breeder on your list.  I have been, willingly, a reference for my breeder several times.  That and  the very slow return of your emails and calls suggest she is, at the very least, very busy.  Very busy people who do not promptly return your email or call and won't contact a satisfied puppy owner are way to busy to raise puppies properly.

You are going to love and live with this puppy a long time.  Focus on health, temperment and size.  You will love any color puppy in two weeks.   

 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I so agree with all of Maryann's comments, both the comments on the breeder's indifference, and the traits you should focus on. Color is the least important factor when choosing a dog. And colors also change. Deep chocolates and deep reds can fade to a much paler shade. Blacks can turn silver. Doesn't matter. Health and temperament, as well as the socialization the breeder has done, should be your priorities, IMO.

Regarding the size, with earlier generations, the breeder estimates are just that...estimates. Many members have dogs who ended up much bigger (and even much smaller) than either parent. 

 

[Carol and Banjo]

You're so right Karen.....I can attest to the size factor.   Banjo's dad was a 17lb mini poodle.  Breeder sold this litter as mini goldendoodles....expected to grow to 30-35lbs.   Banjo at 2.5 years now weighs 52lbs and there's not an ounce of fat on him!

[Shannon and Finn]

Ditto the "go with your gut" advice. I talked and visited with breeders a lot and did a lot of research. In the end I couldn't visit with my selected breeder in person due to the very long drive but also didn't pay anything until I met her and our Finn. She spent a lot of time with me on the phone going over every detail of Finn's temperament, parents history etc. she also sent several videos and photos of him so that I could make the right decision. Temperament and size and coat type were very important to me so I needed to feel confident in my breeder. I talked to her several times and along time at pick up. There are a lot of reasons you want a breeder you feel comfortable with since you will be in contact if anything happens. Good luck and also ditto the fact that colors and shedding and size are hard for a breeder to control unless the dogs have been bred together a lot and the puppies have grown into adults, which is hard since you can't breed dogs that long....

Good luck, it's a lot of work on the front end and I was totally stressed at times! We also lost our family dog recently and so I was obsessed with finding us the right fit since Finn has big paws to fill!

[Linda, Webber and Seda]

I have a bad feeling about this breeder from what you have written.  I cannot imagine a breeder not wanting you to talk to other owners.  A satisfied customer is a most powerful way to sell your dogs.  I wonder if the customers would have something negative to say.  Webber's picture is on his breeder's website and the breeder still responds to the annual pictures I send, after 4.5 years.  I think the breeder in question has something to hide.  Please find another one.

[Jeanette Clark]

I wanted to thank everyone for their thoughts and comments.  It's been good to be reminded that temperment and health are the foremost criteria - and although we have preferences for other characteristics - it is those same variable characteristics that make our dogs the unique parts of our family they are.

Jane was right on - I was wanting this breeder to be the right fit for various reasons that I was willing to overlook the early warning signs.  Learning that the previous breeder we had hoped to work with had changed their breeding plans (after we had been waiting for a while) - and starting over with other breeders, created a self imposed sense of urgency. 

Not where you want to be when considering adding a family member.

I will be looking into the alternate breeder on our list - thanks again for sharing your thoughts and stories.

[Maryann,Roo and Tigger]

Good thinking!!  You won't be sorry you took a step back, sometimes that is so hard to do, but worth it.

[Laurie, Fudge, and Vern]

This sounds right on the money :)

[Jeanette Clark]

My apologies for reaching out this way - but at some point while moving between screens, I thought I had a private message asking me a question related to this thread - but then I couldn't get back to it/find it to respond.  If you are following this and had an unanswered related question to me - please reach out to me again.

 

Sorry about that....

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

No apology needed.  DK is exactly the forum for your question. Best of luck choosing the right breeder and getting the doodle of your dreams.

[Jeanette Clark]

I know we are early into the process....but I was so impressed that I had to share...

We have an alternate breeder already identified that we had been talking with in parrallel to the breeder that prompted this thread (but was hesitant to move them up the list because the current/near term litters were not our #1 choice).

I sent a note moving our conversations forward - and got an almost immediate response.  But here's the impressive component - she was emailing me back from her phone while at the hospital for the birth of her grandson.

No kidding. 

No comparison.

 

[Linda, Webber and Seda]

I like the sound of this one much better!!