One more try

[Native New Yorker]

Does anyone have information regarding the following breeder?  I hate to make another almost 8 hour round trip to discover that this is not a reputable breeder.

Pin Oak Farms, Pennsylvania

http://www.pinoakfarm.com/about.htm

[Natasha]

Regarding your question about whether or not health testing is a helpful guideline to use when considering a new puppy...

The health tests performed are for diseases and malformations that are hereditary in nature. Seeing several generations of tests will give you a good idea of the likelihood that your puppy will develop a problem in the future and help you take the appropriate action to avoid a problem. There isn't a dog on the planet that has perfect genes.

Many hereditary diseases and malformations require a recessive gene from both the father and the mother. The goal of most breeding programs is to introduce bonding pairs that offset each others' weaknesses. So, you are looking for a breeder who can walk you through the backgrounds of multiple generations on both sides. Your job is to educate yourself about the key inheritable diseases and malformations that each breed is prone to and understand which of those require a recessive gene from both parents and which don't. Then, when you look at your prospective puppy's lineage (multiple generations) you can get a good idea if you are likely to encounter something that concerns you. Also, I feel strongly that the breeder should have a very solid understand of genetics and be able to communicate what the tests do and do not show and why certain dogs have been chosen to be a member of the breeding program (for both health and temperament btw).

A responsible breeder will also tell you if any of the puppies bred previously have developed any problems. There was one puppy in our breeder's history that did develop something (I don't recall what it was - it wasn't a concern to us). Any breeder who dismisses the importance of testing and isn't able to talk with you about the puppies that have been bred in the past seems (to me) like a breeder who is not paying attention to their own breeding program and is breeding too many puppies to keep tabs on them.

Also, I wouldn't work with a breeder who didn't have at least a 30 day guarantee against any health issues (like Parvo) and a 2 year guarantee against hereditary health issues.

[Kyoko]

From Teaneck, NJ to Lancaster PA is about 2 1/2 hours drive. May be you can go look at the place before you make a decision?

[Native New Yorker]

It's 3 1/2 hours. I do plan on visiting, but I wanted to know if there was any negative feedback before traveling there. If this breeder had negative feedback then I would not bother.

[Kyoko]

That makes sense. Being able to visit the breeder whenever I wanted to was one of my criteria when I was looking for my puppy.

[Native New Yorker]

I'm starting to think that I will not be able to find a breeder within driving distance. Pennsylvania is on the top of the list for puppy mills. My first experience in PA was not a good one. Now this breeder has informed me that he is unavailable until May - not what I wanted to hear and certainly not a good sign.

[F, Calla & Luca]

Not sure if I told you this yet. I live in Bergen County, too. Yet I had both my doodles shipped to me from the west coast. That said, there are labradoodle breeders in NJ, NY state, Connecticut, Rhode Island, etc. I only looked at labradoodles and it was a matter of what I wanted in a pup, good timing for me etc.

[Allyson, Peri & Taquito]

Did you ever contact the breeder I recommended to you? They are on the Owner Recommended list, member of GANA and under 4 hours of driving distance from you. Sure they may be a few hundred more than you want to spend, but they are higher generation mini doodles and they do all of the testing. It is not the breeder I used, but I feel confident they are reputable and not a puppy mill.

[Kyoko]

I know... especially Lancaster .... :-(

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

That's why you have to know who you're dealing with, and not just search the internet for breeders. As many puppy mills as there are in PA, the puppy mill capital of the country is right here in the Midwest; yet we also have excellent breeders here. I'm sure there are also excellent breeders within a reasonable distance of you.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Here are some of the things I don't like about the breeder in PA. In addition to the fact that the parents are not fully tested, and that they have too many dogs & too many litters, and that they breed the same dogs far too frequently, they also have some misleading statements about doodles in general. I know every doodle owner here is going to laugh when they read this:
"What do doodles require as far as daily grooming?
Doodles coats maintain themselves, for the most part."
ROFL!

[Allyson, Peri & Taquito]

HAHAHA!!!!! I spent an entire hour on Sunday working on combing out Peri's matts. Two key points: 1) she is a mini (1/3 size of a standard; way less body to cover) and 2) she is an f1 (generally easier coat).

ROFL!!!!!!!!

[Natasha]

I am so glad that we lucked out with Rouser's coat. He does shed, but he doesn't matt (even if we don't brush him) or need grooming. He climbs in the tub, gets a good towel rub down, and then air dries as he runs around the house like a crazy dog.

One thought re: why not a puppy mill. I know that your neighbors are saying - why worry about health testing if they are in your price range. It's true, you can get a great dog that never has any trouble. We were going to adopt a mutt from a rescue facility and he came heartworm free, all shots, microchipped, and neutered for $400. The facility is great and the dogs receive a quality environment during their stay.

The problem - we were first time (as adults) dog owners who wanted to train our dog to be a therapy dog and after looking at various breeders, shelters, etc. we determined that seeing the parents and other dogs from the breeding program helped us gauge the type of temperament to expect. We also looked until we found a breeder who we were confident had spent a great deal of time socializing the dogs, caring for the dogs in the home, and who could match us with the right puppy based upon our situation.

We paid $1400 which I feel was fair compensation for the time and resources that the family put into raising the puppies and I had proof that the puppy had been given its shots when they were supposed to be given (one breeder we visited had 4 litters at once, no record-keeping system to speak of, etc. so I really didn't think I could trust the quality of care given).

Now that we are more experienced dog owners, we just might adopt from a shelter if we find a puppy that wasn't weaned too early, but for this go around, I'm very happy with the route we traveled.