Possible reaction to vaccinations

[Katie]

I took my 2 1/2 doodle, Luna, in for her yearly exam and vaccinations.  We discussed at great length my issues with over vaccinating as EVERYTHING makes my dog have diarrhea.  I was basically told that they didn't feel she had reactions to immunizations but instead if she did get diarrhea it was stress induced.  So, they talked me in to do all the vaccinations at once to limit her visits to the office causing more stress.  I wanted to do them all individually on different visits. So, I got the 3 year rabies and the 5 in 1 DLPPV. Everything was fine until one week later.  I noticed her chewing her back paws until they were bleeding.  After examining her paw and not finding anything I decided was indeed just chewing.  I stayed up with her all night to limit her chewing. Called the vet.  They said that this was not a reaction and suggested 25mg benedryl.  They said to give her 3 pills every 12 hours (shes 45 lbs).  So, I gave her 1 knowing she would get diarrhea.  That same evening she started having loose stools.  Then vomitting every 3 to 4 hours thru the night.  Not alot of vomit at all - white colored.  

She is now exhausted from 2 sleepless night and has vomiting and diarrhea.  Im waiting on a call back from the Dr. 

Do you think this a reaction to vaccinations?  Im basically waiting on vomitting to stop to reintroduce a bland diet hopefully this evening.

Luna has a history of chronic colitis.  

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

It's possible that it's a reaction to the vaccines, but it's also possible that it's seasonal allergies. This is the time of year for the symptoms to start, and 2-3 years old is when they typically show up. Also, because Atopy (seasonal allergies) is an immune-mediated disease, and all those vaccines stimulate the immune system, it's possible that the shot triggered the allergy symptoms. However, vomiting is not a symptom of allergies, and I'm not sure what might be causing that. Maybe the benadryl.

Regarding the vaccines, I would never in a million years allow any vet to give my dog a 5-in-1 DLPPV shot. It's totally against current veterinary protocol. There are 3 year versions of the core vaccines (rabies and DPP), and everything else is optional and should be given separately.   The stress from more office visits is not as great a risk as over-vaccinating, IMO. In the future, I would insist that your vet follow the current AAHA vaccine protocol, as outlined in this UC Davis article: http://www.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/vmth/small_animal/internal_medicine/n...

Also, benadryl is not your best choice for treating the itching from allergies. General practice vets are not well-versed in allergy treatments, and may not know that second generation antihistamines like Claritin, Zyrtec, and Allegra are more effective and cause fewer side effects. Omega 3 fatty acids and topical sprays are also helpful. Here's some info on that: http://www.doodlekisses.com/group/healthandmedicalissues/forum/topi...

One more suggestion: If your vet wants to put her on metronidazole for the diarrhea, refuse it. I'd ask for a 4 day course of Cerenia for the vomiting and then start a bland diet. Also, if you don;t have a good probiotic, I'd get some and start it once the vomiting resolves. I recommend Proviable DC, which you can order online. 
I hope this helps. 

[Katie]

Thanks Karen - She is still vomitting about every 3 to 4 hours. 

The vet finally called me back at 5:15 after my second call to them with no response. 

They wanted to do Cerenia injection but I said I want to try the pills instead.  When I got there to pick up the meds they gave me two pills and said to take them both tonight.  They are 24 mg.

Im worried these will make her sicker or not stay down.  She has no interest in food yet.  She does take a drink of water every now and then.  

Should I give them?

Currently getting Luna healthy then finding a new vet.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

The injection might have been a good idea. Then she'd be able to keep the pills down.

I'm surprised they gave you only 2, they're sold in a pack of 4. I guess you can always get more. 

They do work well if she can keep them down long enough to get into her system. They won;t make her sicker. I'd try giving them to her, maybe not long after she vomits so you have a little time until the next round. 

I'm sorry she's having so much trouble. 

[Katie]

Thank you -  Im very worried!  Im used to diarrhea but not all this vomitting.

I do give her proviable but I have not today ans she isn't keeping anything down.

I knew better on the vaccines and Im kicking myself for allowing vet to sway me. 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Well, don't kick yourself. We all make mistakes, lol. But I agree with Trudy that you might consider switching vets. They shouldn't be recommending the 5-in-1 shot to begin with, even for the healthiest dog in the world. 

Titers might also be a good solution. Jack hasn't had any kind of vaccine besides rabies since 2011. he does get bordatella vaccine, but that's given intranasally, and separately from anything else.

I do think asking your vet for Cerenia for the vomiting would be a good idea. 

[Trudy Harlow]

No kicking ourselves! We do the best we can for our beloved doodles, and it isn't easy when we're worried and confronted by someone we HOPE is an expert. I liken your vet's reaction to a doc patting me on the head and saying, "There, there, don't worry your silly little head about it. Just leave it to me to make the decisions." Thankfully, that kind of attitude is outmoded these days but I'd fire that doc, and that's why I said switch vets. Probably should have been gentler about it but I'm typing on my phone at the beach! Hope Luna feels much, much better soon..

[Trudy Harlow]

Switch vets. Then, although I know it's controversial, know that you do not have to keep vaccinating your dog every year. You don't revaccinate yourself, do you? Instead get Luna's titers checked to be sure she's still got immunity to the vaccine. I guarantee she will be. Studies now show that the vaccines have been proved to be good for at least 7-10 years in most dogs. The only vaccine my dogs get now is the rabies, which is required by law. And once my doodle, who is now 9, gets to be a couple of years older, I'll stop that, too. There's simply no point.

[Patty and my boy, Seamus]

Hi, Katie... Luna has a good mom. You're doing everything you can for her.  I would suggest that if you're not happy with the response you get from your vet when they call you back or when you take her in this time, you get a second opinion. Maybe you'll even find you like another vet better if you take her elsewhere for another vet's take on her issues.

I don't know if it's a reaction to the shots, Katie, but I do know that it's highly recommended by many vets and breeders *not* to give them shots together. It upset me when I first read your post this morning, because I think they gave you terrible advice, but I couldn't figure out how to reply, it's been so long since I was here. (Finally figured out there was no reply box because I wasn't signed in!! : /   )

I'm sure you can find sources to support the belief that only essential vaccines should be given, and those should be given alone at well spaced intervals.  Also, you might want to look into having titers done instead of shots whenever possible. That's a test to see if your dog still has immunity from the last time she had a particular vaccine, thereby showing she doesn't need it again yet. Since I've started doing that, I'm amazed at how many years can go by before immunity wears off.  Of course, in most places you have to get rabies, but the three shot one is usually deemed a better option, and it should be given alone.

I know none of this is a priority now... The vaccine issue can wait till Luna is diagnosed and treated, or she just gets better.

I'm only an experienced dog owner... not a medical expert, but that many symptoms don't sound like allergies to me...maybe it's something triggered by allergies, or it's maybe a virus of some kind.  Whatever it is, I hope you get answers and Luna is treated and gets well quickly. Please keep us posted. I know how awful it is when we're worried about them!!!!

[Katie]

I want to thank all you for your responses.  They really did help.  I'm concentrating on getting Luna better then I will be finding a new vet.  They are great vets and come highly recommended but at the end of the day if they don't listen to me then it's not a good fit for Luna and I.  They now believe me that she has a sensitive stomach.  

I did give her the Cerenia (only gave her one 24mg tablet) around 7:30 pm and she has had no vomiting since.  YEAH!!  She had a pretty good nights sleep which we both needed.  I tried to give her a few small amount of scrambled eggs and she turned her head with no interest.  My goal today is to get a little food in her.  She is drinking water.