Doodle and a 2.5 year old toddler

[UggaMugga]

I'm looking for advice from those with younger dogs. We are considering adding a doodle to our family. Kids are 2.5, 9 and 11. The youngest is allergic to dog saliva. Only saliva. Doesn't have other symptoms. We have explored numerous dogs. Today she interacted with a doodle. Doodle licked her eye. It got red, itchy and watery. We gave her some Zyrtec and it resolved. We visited for about 90 minutes all together. She pet the dog, crawled on the floor.
Of course with a puppy or any dog really this age child would never be left unattended. Even with our old dog I had concerns baby might hurt the dog. Is it unreasonable to think we can keep a puppy away from a toddlers face?
It's been 13 years since I did the puppy thing. We never had issues with our older dog.

[Jessica, Loki and Moose]

I think the "hypoallergenic breed" have less of the proteins people are allergic too. They still have some but way less. I used to babysit for a family that had two PWD's and the father and daughter were highly allergic to dogs and they had no issues. I'm trying to remember the protein name or the article I was reading...

[Laura and Angus]

You could be right, but my understanding was that the difference between "hypoallergenic" breeds and non is that they have hair and not fur. That means that their dander, or the amounts of dander coming off of them is different (based on the protein idea you're mentioning, perhaps there's a difference in the dander itself - not sure on this one). However, someone allergic to saliva and not dander would react to all saliva - perhaps varying in degrees based on breed, again not sure. So someone with a saliva issue reacts to all dogs - for example another cousin of mine could not be around our standard poodle. I think it varies if they are allergic to saliva, dander, or both. You can be highly allergic to something, but if a dog has fur and not dander they don't shed nearly as much and thus lose much less dander to impact allergies. It's like people shedding - I pretty much shed more than our dog lol

[Jessica, Loki and Moose]

That was always my understanding, the hair/ fur thing but I read this article a while back and now I'm kicking myself for not saving it! I do know the texture of my dogs "hair/fur" feels much different than a labs but also much different than say a PWD so maybe it is some type of hair/fur mix? not sure how that works lol! I could be completely wrong though because obviously not everything on the internet is true lol. SO TRUE about shedding more than the dog! When I brush my hair there's more hair in the brush than when I brush Loki, Moose is going through his coat change so he's one hot mess right now lol. I will try and find were I read about that protein... maybe I read it on DK even... 

[Laura and Angus]

Oh man the dreaded coat change. How old is Moose now? We think Angus went through his a few months ago because he started matting super easily in random spots. We're still trying to figure out how to keep him from getting matted between his toes! Sheesh! 

The whole allergy thing is certainly baffling and you're right there's a ton of information out there on the interwebs that's both true and untrue. That's why I think it's best to work with an allergist on this one..

[UggaMugga]

Interesting you mention the PWD. My brother who is super allergic to all mammalian animals as they trigger his asthma can sit with a PWD in his lap. It's one of the reasons I thought maybe there is dog out there for us.

[UggaMugga]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3652036/

I read this.  There is a lot of science here.  Saliva differs by breed and by dog.

[Jessica, Loki and Moose]

Ok so I ask Karen and Jackdoodle because I was pretty sure they had posted it and here is the discussion that I must have read and they came through for us! The link to the old discussion is below. I think you have to read Karen and Nancy's comments.

http://www.doodlekisses.com/forum/topics/goldendoodles-and-allergies.

http://www.webmd.com/allergies/video/hypoallergenic-dogs

The second link is a link to a video Karen posted on my page. Hope this helps, I found both of these useful.

http://www.doodlekisses.com/forum/topics/goldendoodles-and-allergies.

http://www.webmd.com/allergies/video/hypoallergenic-dogs

[Laura and Angus]

Yes! The video is totally what I was thinking and it's definitely concerning like the dr. mentioned on there that you just don't know how it will affect you over time! Certainly good to work with an allergist ahead of time. Thanks for sharing these resources!

[Julie, Eloise & Beasley]

I'll add my experience, though it will probably only add to the confusion. ;)  I'm not allergic to dogs (evidently with at least one exception, so far), but in reading this discussion I recalled that my friend had Pharaoh hounds about 15 years ago - and I broke out into severe, localized hives whenever one licked me.  That happened 100% of the time with licks, over the course of several years. It was bizarre because I've never, ever reacted to dogs' saliva - except those, and I've been around just around every kind of dog at some point throughout my life.  Obviously this is only anecdotal, and I never saw a doctor for the hives, but I just wanted to share my experience with the saliva reaction.  I have severe allergies to cats, and pretty bad seasonal allergies and to dust/mold, but I don't react to dogs (except the above).  So at least in my case, the saliva allergy doesn't seem to apply to any dogs except those particular ones.

You're clearly doing your research, and similar to what others have said, even with all the information available, there's still so much we don't know about allergies and immune responses.  (Frustrating when you'd just like an answer, I know!)  I hope you find a solution that can work for your daughter and family.  Good luck!  :)

[UggaMugga]

This is so crazy. The first dog with the first reaction was a hound. I remember the owner telling someone else at the farm. It is what makes me totally fearful to even get a shelter dog. Thank you for responding. It helps me not feel so crazy trying to pursue this.

[Jessica, Loki and Moose]

I believe if someone is allergic to dogs, they are allergic to a specific protein found in all dog dander (saliva, urine, skin, etc..) and swear I remember reading an article a while back that speculated there are high concentrations of this protein in the saliva which causes more reactions in people. My sister has minor dog allergies and for her she's fine around dogs as long as she doesn't put her face right in the dogs fur and breath in. I can tell you that my older doodle, almost two, does not shed at all but people with allergies still have some problems with him. Some of these people have really bad animal allergies and it sounds like your child is on the milder side of it so maybe this would not be an issue, but I just wanted to put it out there.  

But I do think some puppies are fine with kids and I think others would not do well for your situation, with the licking. My older dog has always been calm and a great listener and passed he therapy dog exam just shy of a year and a half, he's always been fantastic with kids and is just not a "licky" guy. The younger one would be a disaster in your situation, he is very very high energy and has to lick and mouth everything he comes in contact with. If you remind he "no mouth" he stops immediately but at 10 months old, he does need to be reminded. The concern I would have for you is that if he licks your child's face, but stops immediately when told, thats great but your child still got licked in the face and now might have some form of a reaction. I do agree you can teach a dog anything through lots of hard work and training but they have to be given time to learn it. I'm not sure if being licked in the face constantly, for potentially months until they learn, would make their allergies worse or not effect them. 

I personally don't have kids but Loki (the older dog) visits with inpatient children and adolescents at a psychiatric hospital and I have to watch the kids like a hawk. All kids are un predictable and it seems like a full time job. In your situation it would be obviously different since they are your own kids. I guess I just wanted to share this up because even if you can trust your dog 100% to  behave, and you have the perfect dog for your kids, like Kaitlin said, you still have to watch the toddler . 

Good luck in your hunt for a puppy :)

[UggaMugga]

Thank you. We have a lot to think about. Many kids outgrow things such as this but obviously chronic exposure could make her much worse over time. I have a coworker who agreed to be our backup in the event it ended disastrously. The thought makes me ill but I have to be realistic.
Kid broke out in localized hives this afternoon on her thighs an nose while I was at work. Hasn't been around dogs in well over 24 hours and they certainly were not on her thighs. This is way worse than anything reaction I have seen to a dog with her. We may be forced to table the whole thing for a bit. I hate to admit though.