Venting About Puppy Kindergarten Brow-Beating

[Toddworth & Allison]

Hello y'all- I just wanted to take a moment to vent about the cruddy experience Bartleby, Allison and I had tonight at our first obedience school class.

In a nutshell, we were the second to last ones to join the group and all the other dogs--three poodles, a Great Dane, and some little bugger--were subdued when we came in. The trainer who ran the class saw that our 3 m.o. pup was straining on his leash, wanting to play with the other dogs. Bartleby is a very social dog, and his favorite thing in the world is to go romp around with other dogs. Our friends' and relatives' dogs, dogs at the dog park, whatever, that's his thing. And yes, he does really pull on the leash when other dogs are around. So of course he's pulling on his leash in a room full of other dogs. Initially. Because of this first impression, the trainer went on to make all sorts of assumptions and accusations about my wife and I and of course Bartleby. Passive-aggressive comments were slung, too, and I was wondering if she's giving us guff for normal goldendoodle behavior...

So, off the top of my head: She saw he was energetic and accused us of not getting him enough exercise (we walk him 2-3 times per day, although he wouldn't walk during the day today because it was *ninety-eight degrees*) and also assumed we're feeding him plebeian dog food (we're feeding the good stuff as per our vet's recommendation, Nutro Max). We said he's very social and loves the dog park and got exercise by playing and swimming there (she scoffed, saying dog parks were not a good idea (?!?)) She said he looked overweight (actually he just needs to be groomed, so he looks a lot bigger than he is. 25 lbs., our vet weighed him yesterday and said all was well.) He aced the portion of the class where we had him sit, lie down, and respond to his name, and the trainer said, "geez, he actually did very well." This is the positive feedback we get?

Do your three-month old doodles love to go meet other dogs? Are we awful parents because we let him approach strange dogs at the park?  

We've been under the impression that he's been doing well, based on what we deem acceptable behavior and the comments of those who have met him. I'd love to hear your comments about this!

[Jennifer and Luci]

I had an almost identical experience with our first training class when Luci was about 4 months old.  Trainer told me she'd never be a 'working dog' and to come back in a couple of years when she 'calmed down'.  Really, she did great and her only problem was wanting to go play with the other dogs.  Turned out, that trainer hates Doodles, and nothing was going to change her mind.  

I hired a private trainer, who has told me that that first trainer must have been crazy because this pup almost begs to 'work'.  She's easy to train and doing great with the new trainer.  The trainer has said she wished all her clients were as easy to train and eager to please, so pooh on the first trainer.  She IS excitable and hyper when we're out, full of energy...she's 16 months old though so I'm pretty sure that's normal!  This trainer is the same though, in not wanting her to go off to meet other dogs.  She's told me, and convinced me, that it's very important that she wait for my permission to greet anyone.  Her focus should always be on me.  We're working on it.  As long as I'm loaded down with treats, we can now stand in the middle of a busy mall and she will concentrate on me.  Without the treats, doubtful she'd be so attentive :D.

[Toddworth & Allison]

Thanks a ton for the reassurance, Jennifer. I sort of wondered about the 'trainer hates Doodles' idea--this woman specializes in show dogs (hence the plethora of immaculately groomed poodles in the class) so an 'unrecognized hybrid breed' may get under her skin. After the class, when Al and I talked about what Bartleby could've done to elicit such rude comments from this woman, the only thing we had to go on was the tugging on the leash and...<ahem> 'enthusiastic demeanor.' He's no angel, but definitely not deserving of an hour's berating.

We've got to work on the 'eat, then greet' training, I suppose. So what's the proper order of events with that?

1. Other dog appears / 2. Bartleby pulls on the leash toward the other dog / 3. I have him sit? (treat for sitting) / 4. I say 'go say hello,' and then give him another treat before he does?   

[Jennifer and Luci]

It could have nothing to do with 'doodles', but that was certainly my experience with our first trainer.  We had one that I wanted to hire to help us with service dog training, that refused to help if we didn't get a poodle.  Showed her the door lol.  

Every trainer might be different in their teaching, so I can only say what mine has me doing.  Most everything is originally taught with absolutely no commands, until I'm sure she will absolutely follow it.  If I was to tell her to sit when another dog walked up, well it wouldn't go over well with her at all.  I doubt she'd comply.  Instead, I have super awesome I want those so bad treats available (usually ziwipeak food, for some reason she'll do almost anything for it LOL).  As soon as we see someone, I get her attention.  I may have to back away, walk to the left or right or whatever...just get her attention on me.  Even if we have to walk off the trail.  For her, she's happiest in a down stay so she now will usually put herself in a down.  If not, I do have to give that command, but it's something she's very well trained on.  Every time she looks at me, she gets a treat.  If she looks at me, she's making the choice to pay attention to me rather than whatever/whoever is walking by.  That way, she gets rewarded for her good choices without me saying a word other than to praise her.  We usually go to a busy outdoor mall type area with lots of people walking around and just practice until she's too tired to look at anyone lol

[Bob Johnston]

We have our first puppy kindergarten class tomorrow night and I am dreading the same thing. We have a lot under control potty training not chewing on everything in sight but getting excited when we see someone or something new is still under construction. My first thought is that if our dogs were perfectly behaved we wouldnt need to go to training classes and that trainer would be out of a job :) Our class trainer told us the first class which was for owners only to go over what we want to get out of the class how she runs classes and such is that the first class with dogs is going to be one of barking jumping and all out chaos. All the dogs are meeting each other for the first time and all the humans to so its to be expected. we will open every class with a short puppy play time to try to get all the craziness out of the way so class will go some what smoothly. I kinda cant get over she said your dog was over weight that even has me worked up a bit. sorry thats not fat its fluff. maybe your not used to having doodles in your class so here is a great website you can educate yourself on them. Then Id mubble to myself ,atleast my dog can hide thier figure under all that hair but those pants you squeezed into tonight are doing nothing for you. zing 

[Toddworth & Allison]

Zing! I think starting with a short puppy play time sounds like a good idea, since he wanted to say hello to everyone and was basically getting worked up because usually we introduce him to other people and other dogs immediately. I look forward to hearing about your experience, Bob!

[Adina P]

He sounds like a very normal puppy...not just a normal goldendoodle puppy.  A high energy puppy that will be awesome to train (though not easy) because he'll have lots of energy to give you in training and perform with exuberance =)  But because he's as energetic as he is and loves to pull on leash, etc...you will have to be diligent in your training of him because he'll probably test boundaries a lot.  But that doesn't make him bad, just more energetic than the other dogs in your class.  I think MOST young dogs that aren't shy love to meet other dogs.  But I also think it's a bad idea to let them do it while they pull or are on leash.  Leash time should be 'work' time and dogs are well served (and so are you) to consider leash time YOUR time not their time.  Otherwise you get an adult dog who thinks they can do anything on leash and that's usually when you want them on their best behavior because on leash means out in public.

As to dog parks, I'm mixed.  I think it can be fun for a lot of young dogs, but it can also allow them to practice and learn all sorts of bad behavior because they are free to do as they please.  But that's up to you...if you don't mind, then it's not a problem.

[Helen & Kirby]

A big part of puppy kindergarten is socializing the puppies.  Part of every class should include playtime with the other puppies, off leash if permissable, with the trainer showing you what to look for in behaviors, and how to get your dog (or practice recalls) and return to  calm, ready for class.  We always alternated between play and work, and it was the best class I ever had.  However the first puppy class I enrolled in was strickly obedience no fun for the pups at all -  so I had to seek out another class with another trainer.

[Laurie, Fudge, and Vern]

I can tell you from two past experiences with trainers that many of them have a preconceived notion that Doodles are "designer dogs," purchased by people who don't know a thing about dogs. I had a trainer go on and on about breeding practices of Doodle breeders and although I liked him very much for what he could offer my dogs, I did not agree with him at all about Doodles. I had another trainer look at Fudge and Vern and say, "do you groom these dogs an hour a day?"which she could clearly tell I did not and I tried explaining that Vern rolls daily in something, but she had already formed her opinion about Doodles and Doodle owners, and frankly, I did not care what she thought about me or my choice to get a dog of my choosing. So, my best advice is, if the trainer is offering you something you need to make your dog successful, then I would just "agree to disagree." If you feel her opinions are getting in the way of good and fair training then I would move on and find another trainer. Good luck!

By the way, the puppy classes I took my two to, offered play time in the beginning which helped immensely with the energy level once class started.

[Bob Johnston]

Well our first class went better then I thought. There was one dog who barked the whole time and might have been asked to not come back. Sophie managed to not eat any of the smaller dogs which was all but 1 black lab. We even had a tea cup yorkie in class smaller then Sophie's head and a mini Aussie Shepard that was 6 lbs. Sophie was also one of the oldest at 4 months most were 3 months old. We did well walking around and sitting during the talking periods. Sophie even gotten taken up in front of the class to show how to teach them the relax command. She as pretty stubborn at first making the trainer really work but finally gave in and laid down. I could hear the other people in class saying she is so smart and good. I'm sure I was grinning ear to ear thinking yep that is my little monster. She must have used up all her good behavior in class because she is living up to the monster name tonight. As I type this out she is taking a little bit of a time out. All in all I am very proud of my baby and classes can only make her a better doodle. Heres hoping your class next week shows them how fast your doodle can learn and your trainer gives bartleby some praise.

[Lucy & AnnaBelle's Mom]

All of our training classes when the girls were puppies were at night.  When we would get home they were like terrors and it took forever to get them settled down.  We mentioned this to the instructor and she said it is like an overtired toddler ... just put them to bed.  Problem solved.