Benefits of grain free???

[Mary ann & Lincoln]

Hi, I am new at this and was wondering about the benefits of all of the grain free brands.  isn't too much protein bad for them? 

We have a 15 week old goldendoodle and he is on Pro plan Plus from the breeder and our vet was Ok wiht that too. 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Hi Mary Ann, welcome to the Food Group. We have many years worth of info here in our discussion section, and have talked about these issues extensively. You may want to read through some of our discussions.

To answer your questions, there is really no such thing as "too much protein" when it comes to a dog's diet. There are only three sources of calories: protein, fat, and carbohydrates. Protein is a dog's natural food, it's what they eat in the wild, along with fat; that's what animal prey is composed of, protein and fat. Carbohydrates are plant foods, and grains are more difficult for a dog to digest or utilize; grains in pet foods are basically fillers.

Even in the grain-free foods with the highest protein content, like the 40% in Orijen, that leaves 60% of the calories being supplied by fats and carbohydrates. If the fat content is 20%, that leaves 40% of the calories supplied by carbs, an amount equal to the protein content. So clearly, in a food with a lower protein content, you have most of the calories being supplied by carbohydrates. 

Grains are also more likely to provoke allergic responses than any other type of food ingredient; wheat and corn being the biggest culprits. Even in humans, wheat and gluten allergies are relatively common.

That said, many dogs do fine with a diet that does contain some of the healthier grains such as oats, barley or rice. These carbohydrates help to fill the dog up, so foods containing grains can be beneficial for dogs who have big appetites and always seem to be looking for food. Conversely, for dogs who are not big eaters, you get more bang for your buck with a grain-free, high protein food. You generally need to feed less when the food has a higher protein content. 

One thing that we have discussed here often is the fact that it has been well-documented that there is no nutrition curriculum in veterinary school, and most GP vets are really not knowledgeable about food or diets. This is not much different from our own human doctors. Vets and MDs are trained in medicine, not nutrition. The big difference is that our doctors don't sell us food or recommend food brands, and they are not influenced by huge multinational food corporations. Sadly, this is not the case with vets. The fact that they are heavily influenced by "Big Dog Food" (Iams, Purina, Hills, Mars) has been well-documented, and is actually a conflict of interest. The point being that many of us have learned not to take advice on diet or food from our vets.

if you look at our recommended brands list, you will see that Purina is not listed. Neither is Nutro, Science Diet, Iams, and many other common brands. The reason for this is that all of these brands are owned by huge multinational corporations (Mars, Proctor & Gamble, Nestle's, etc) whose main concern is the shareholders and the bottom line. These corporations use third party food brokerages to purchase their ingredients from the cheapest sources, which are almost always in China. You may be aware that thousands of dogs and cats died or were made permanently and seriously ill by tainted pet foods containing Chinese ingredients during the huge recalls of 2007, and more recently the same has happened to many dogs as a result of chicken jerky treats from China. We do not recommend any brand that uses ingredients from China or other third world countries. We also do not recommend any brand that uses artificial preservatives or certain synthetic vitamins, either. 

I hope this answers your questions. :) 

[Cathy, Fozzie & Shaggy]

Thanks, Karen!  I always learn something new when I read your comments and this time is no different.  I had not thought about the percentages of protein, carbs, and fats in my dog's food before.  This will help as I try to find a new food that is affordable AND has quality protein that my picky eater (Fozzie) will eat.  

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Regarding the "affordable" part, keep in mind that you really can't go by the price on the bag. In many cases, you feed have to 30-50% more of a "lower priced" food than one that initially costs more. If you go through 3 bags of food A in the same period of time that you would go through 2 bags of food B, you have to compare the price per bag accordingly. In other words, if food A costs $40 per bag and the same sized bag of food B costs $50 per bag, food A would cost $120 versus $100 for food B in the same period of time. 

We also have some price comparison discussions here in the "Featured Discussions" section, with calculations for some of the recommended brands.  

[Cathy, Fozzie & Shaggy]

I will definitely check out the discussions and calculations to help make the change.  I've been through SO MANY foods in the last 6 years (my fault).  Both my boys like and do well on BB but if they are going to mess around with their ingredients and suppliers, then I'm done with them.  

Thanks Karen!!

[Kaitee and Orwell]

What Karen said is very true. I've switched my boy over to Orijen, but getting there was a process. I originally wanted that brand, but I thought it was too expensive, so I got Zignature thinking they were of similar quality and would have the same feeding portions. How was I wrong... when my boy is his final size, he would have to eat almost double than that of Orijen. And Zignature is only about 10% cheaper per bag of Orijen. If I stayed with Zignature, I'd almost be paying double. 

Also, it should be noted that some food brands have rewards programs and some do not. Orijen/Acana have a rewards program where you get a free bag every 10 bags. Zignature had nothing of the sort.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Another disadvantage to foods with a high grain content is that are usually very high in Omega 6 fatty acids, which can cause inflammation, and too low in beneficial Omega 3 fatty acids. 

[Mary ann & Lincoln]

Wow, thnak you for all the info.  I will checkout some of the pricing info tohelp select a new brand and to see what is available in my area.  There is a new pet store near me that sells alot of unusual foods ( at least to me) but I was concerned if they close then where do i buy that food. 

[Jennifer & Truffle]

Many of us here on doodle kisses.com use www.chewy.com to order food and treats and other supplies for our dogs. They sell many of the food brands that are on the recommended food list here. It's one of my favorite websites - the prices are reasonable, they're reliable and their customer service is great!

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Mary Ann, I think you will be surprised to see how many little pet supply stores that carry our recommended brands are located in your area. Many people have used the manufacturers' store locators on the websites to find small privately owned pet boutiques that they never even knew existed in their areas. Others have found that many of our recommended foods are sold at garden supply centers and even stores that specialize in bird feeding supplies. Our recommended brands list has links to the websites and most of them have store locator tools. 

And many of our recommended brands are available at the bigger pet supply chains. 

Where you will not find them are stores like Target, Walmart, Kmart, or grocery stores. 

[Kaitee and Orwell]

I would definitely recommend trying to buy from a boutique. I don't know about anyone else, but because I buy food from them I get some free grooming services. 

...and they didn't charge me for shipping when they had to order the Orijen Large Puppy formula that they normally don't carry because they mainly cater to smaller dogs. 

[J and Riley (and Luna)]

Petsmart has been carrying some of the recommended brands too.  Definitely Wellness and Nature's Variety anyway.

We have always had the best luck with our local small boutique pet stores though.  We're extra lucky because we're Canadian and the closest store likes to be fully stocked on Canadian-made products like Champion foods stuff :)

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

In addition to all the truly important reasons to choose grain-free over grained, when eating grain-free dogs need to poo less often and the poo is firm.