Should I switch from ACANA Singles to Zignature LID?

[Samantha & Charlie]

Up until a few days ago, Charlie was doing great on Acana. Lately though, he's been having horrible diarrhea and threw up twice on Thursday (food wasn't digested). On Friday, he had no diarrhea and didn't throw up (I had him on a chicken and rice diet). Today, the diarrhea came back, but he's also sensitive to chicken, so that might be a factor why his stomach is still upset. He's been acting fairly active as well. But someone suggested to try the Zignature line, and I thought kangaroo might be a good meat to try out. Any advice on this brand?

Could he start having issues with a food brand after being on it for 8ish months?

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I can assure you that he doesn't have an "issue with a food brand", lol, because that's impossible. The brand is just a name. Any issues caused by any food would be caused a particular ingredient, most likely a protein, and he would have an issue with any formula containing that ingredient from any brand. (Digestive issues can also be due to the particular macronutrient profile of a food, i.e. too much fat, too little protein, not enough fiber, too high an Omega 6:3 ratio, but that wouldn't take 8 months to show up.) And yes, a dog can start to have issues with a particular ingredient after eating it for 8 months. It takes repeated exposure to a particular protein for a sensitivity to develop.  

So it's not necessary to switch brands if you think he's developed a sensitivity to his current formula, all you have to do is try a different Singles formula. Which one was he eating? 

The vomiting makes me think that something other than a sensitivity to something in the current food may be going on. Are you absolutely certain that he hasn't ingested anything he shouldn't? No new treats, nothing he picked up outdoors,etc? No socks missing? 

[Samantha & Charlie]

I'm 99% sure he hasn't gotten into anything he wasn't supposed to. If he did, wouldn't the vomiting have continued? He has kept everything down since Thursday. And no new treats.

I switched him to Acana Duck in April, and before that, he was on Pork. I just realized after posting my original comment how much more itchy he has been since feeding him the chicken and rice. I also noticed weird spots (like a rash) on his stomach. He's also had an increase in eye boogers. Even before he had the major diarrhea on Thursday, his stool was starting to get really soft several days prior. However, I think the chicken is making it worse.

I was going to take him to the vet yesterday if both the diarrhea and vomiting continued, but he was 100% fine. I will probably end up taking him to the vet on Monday, as long as he doesn't start to vomit, then it will be immediately.

I also just gave him some Tylan Powder and Pro Pectalin in the meantime. But I did switch back to feeding him the Acana kibble as the chicken and rice seemed to not be agreeing with him.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

What proteins has he not eaten on a regular basis? If he hasn't had beef, you could substitute very lean, well-drained ground beef for the chicken in the homemade food. 

Knowing which proteins he hasn't had on a regular basis will also help us figure which kibble you could switch him to. 

[Deborah Brown]

My Charlie is sensitive too. We keep him away from poultry, fish and white potatoes.  He did OK on Acana pork but didn't like it.  He likes Orijen regional red but it has some fish in it.  We've been trying Zignture lamb and so far so good.

The limited ingredient diet seems to help his tummy but not his skin issues.  I think that might be more environmental as it is worse in the summer.

So, no advice here, but if you want to give Zignature a try, I'm finding the LID more limiting than Acana.  

[Samantha & Charlie]

He's been on almost every type of protein out there, except the rare ones, like kangaroo. He hasn't tried any of the fish products.

He's been on Lamb, Chicken, Venison, Turkey, Pork, and Duck. Honestly, I don't know if he's tried Beef, but wouldn't it be like Chicken or Turkey? Out of all of those mentioned, he's done well on Pork. Duck may be okay (as that's what he's been on for the past couple months), but maybe something better is out there for him.

So far, he has been given the kibble and pumpkin together last night and this morning, and he hasn't thrown up. However, he hasn't pooped since yesterday evening (right before I gave him the kibble). So I have yet to see if he's ok in that area. I did also notice that ever since giving him the chicken, he has been biting his paws a lot more. So I know I definitely can't put him on that again. And those spots that are forming on his stomach look like hot spots, so I did put some Rx spray on those.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I don't know why you would think that beef would be "like" chicken or turkey, lol. Nothing like them at all. Even chicken and turkey are completely different from a molecular standpoint, and it's the specific protein molecule that triggers the reaction in cases of food allergies. :)

All Orijen formulas contain fish, and I think the Acana Regionals do too. The type of fish matters, though. So if the only fish he's had is salmon, say, trout or whitefish or any other fish would still be novel. 

The problem with going to kangaroo at this point is that IF he does have food allergies, you are running yourself out of options for novel proteins, and you're going to have major problems down the line finding a food he can eat. So if pork works for him, I'd stay with that. Or try a fish based food that doesn't contain fish he's had before. 

If you can make a list of the specific formulas that he's eaten on a regular basis in the past, I can help you figure out which ones he hasn't had. 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I'm also thinking about the fact that with Charlie having been on so many different foods in such a short time (he's only been eating any kind of solid food for 7 months), it would just about make veterinary history if he did have a food allergy at this point, since it takes a minimum of three months of eating the same food day in and day out for a food allergy to develop, and even that is rare; it typically takes a year. So I have to think that the digestive issues are not related to a specific protein, except possibly chicken, as it's most likely that he was started on chicken and ate it for the first few months of his life. 

What else does he get in the way of treats, chews, etc? 

[Samantha & Charlie]

I meant beef being like chicken or turkey as in they are all pretty common fillers. If he's sensitive to chicken and turkey, I would assume beef would be like it.

I can tell you all the brands he's tried if that would help (in order of when Charlie has been on the brand):

- Great Life Limited Ingredient Grain-Free Duck (this gave him diarrhea)

- Fromm Puppy Gold (I wanted him to be on a grain-free diet so I took him off of this...I forget if there were any bad results with this one)

- Acana Grain-Free Grasslands (after a few months on this, he started itching and having diarrhea)

- Nature's Variety Grain-Free in both Duck and Lamb (worse product we tried as Charlie had both vomiting and diarrhea with this)

- Natural Balance LID Venison and Sweet Potato (this gave him horrible diarrhea after the first couple bags)

- Earthborn Holistic Meadow Feast Grain-Free (this gave him diarrhea)

- Wellness Simple Turkey and Potato (he started to get diarrhea and also started to avoid eating this food altogether)

And now he is on the Acana Singles line. He's about 2.5 years old now, so with all these brands in the past, I would wait a couple months to see how they worked. However, the ones that gave him immediate grief (like Nature's Variety), I took him off ASAP.

I rarely give him treats or bones, but if I do, they have a peanut butter flavor or I fill a hollowed out bone with PB.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Chicken, turkey and beef are all animal proteins, and as such, they are not "fillers". "Fillers" in pet food refers to ingredients that provide little nutrition and are just there to supply bulk and empty calories. :)

I don't know why I thought he was only 8 months old.

Beef is actually not all that common in dog food any more, due to the cost. And even when an ingredient is common, if your dog hasn't eaten it, he can't be sensitive to it. Sensitivities are specific. There's no reason to suspect that Charlie would have a problem to beef. 

Sometimes, digestive problems can be due to the macronutrient profile rather than to a particular ingredient. Higher fat formulas can cause problems for dogs with sensitive digestive systems. 

And some dogs just have sensitive stomachs, or worse. Irritable Bowel Syndrome is thought to be stress related. Inflammatory Bowel Disease is immune-mediated and most often has no clear cause. It sounds like Charlie's problem may be this kind of thing, because honestly, that's an awful lot of different proteins, ingredients, and types of formulas that he can't tolerate. 

Have you tried probiotics? What is he getting in way of treats and chews?

I'll be very honest, if this were my dog, at this point I'd be having some testing done to make sure this isn't IBD. 

You can try a homemade beef & sweet potato diet (rice can be a problem for a lot of dogs, especially those on grain free diets.) 50/50 lean ground beef (90% lean or better), drained of all fat and rinsed in hot water after cooking and plain cooked sweet potatoes. Once he's better, you can try going back to the Acana Pork & Squash formula, or you could try the Zignature Kangaroo.

The problem is that if this is IBD, after a while, the symptoms are going to come back, no matter what he's eating. 80% of all dogs with IBD require drugs to manage the disease. 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I just looked at the protein sources in the foods you listed, and the only one that contains chicken is Fromm Puppy Gold, which didn't seem to cause a digestive problem. So I'm wondering why you believe that he has a sensitivity to chicken? 

Besides kangaroo, the proteins that aren't in any of the foods listed are:

Salmon

Trout

Bison

Pork

Rabbit

Not easy to find a low fat, limited ingredient food that only contains one of those. 

Zignature makes an LID salmon & trout formula that I've been considering trying for JD, who does have IBD. You might consider that one as well as the kangaroo. 

[Samantha & Charlie]

To answer your questions from the previous post....I have not tried probiotics. I only give him pumpkin when his diarrhea/constipation flares up. The vet has definitely told me he has GI issues. They even wanted him to be put on an Rx diet, but I refuse for him to be on those. But in all honesty, he has not had ANY problems like this for the last several months, so I haven't even thought to ask the vet about meds or put him on a probiotic.

The only treat that he gets is this: http://www.nutro.com/natural-dog-food/nutro/treats-biscuits/crunchy...

And he rarely gets those. Most of the time, I'm filling a bone with PB. As far as him having a sensitivity to chicken, I remembered in the past he would act up on certain treats that contained chicken. Just like how he got the chicken and rice diet, he all of a sudden developed hot spots, massive itching, and biting his paws. None of these were there several days ago.

I will say that I'm getting concerned he hasn't passed any stool since yesterday evening. I fed him his kibble last night, this morning, tonight....and nothing. I also don't know that since I gave him the Tylan Powder (two feedings), Pro Pectalin (yesterday), and pumpkin (two feedings) if that was overkill and now he could be constipated. Or could he really have a blockage? And if this problem clears up, should I continue on Acana or go to something else?

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Stop the Nutro treats. Nutro is not a recommended brand, and these treats contain chicken meal, rice, oats, and a ton of peanuts in various forms. 

Check our recommend treat list for some better options. Maybe just dehydrated sweet potato chews. 

And there is almost no food in the world higher in fat than peanut butter. I'd stop that too. 

If he acted up on certain treats, it may not have been the chicken, there may have been other ingredients in them that caused a problem. No way to know. The fact is, it could be the rice in your chicken and rice mixture and not the chicken that's causing a problem. Rice is a grain. My guy can't tolerate rice, never could. 

All over the internet, dogs are suddenly developing hot spots, including in several posts right here on DK. Welcome to late summer allergy season. That's a possibility too. 

If anything is causing constipation, it's the pro-pectalin. It's really not supposed to be used for more than 48 hours. Since the diarrhea has stopped for now, I'd stop it. Tylan wouldn't be constipating him. Rice is also binding. How much pumpkin are you giving him?
I would order Proviable KP and DC online, it has helped a lot of dogs here with digestive issues. 

If he doesn't have a bowel movement by tomorrow, I'd call the vet. 

Honestly, with all this going on, I wouldn;t introduce a new food, even once the diarrhea clears up. I'd do the homemade beef & sweet potato diet until things improve and then slowly try to reintroduce the Acana Pork again.