Calcium

[Janie]

Is anyone worried about your dogs getting to much calcium. I am more worried about this then to much protein.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Yes, now I see it; "1.0 to 1.8 percent of the dry weight as calcium".
I tried looking at the labelling info on some of the premium foods, and couldn't find this info on any of them, except for one, which had 1.6 percent. They tell you the protein, fat, water, etc., but not the nutrient percentage.
I would still not worry about the premium foods. It also says "Low quality dog foods often contain 2 and even 3 percent". And if you add homecooked foods, you're reducing it even more.
I'm going to keep looking for the info on the premium foods, though.

[Janie]

I called Taste Of The Wild because I wanted to feed it to my dogs.Pacific Stream Canine Formula is the only one that fit what I was looking for... the others were to high in calcium for large breed growing puppies. When my youngest is older I will switch between them.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Okay, I just looked at Fromm's website, and the food I'm feeding Jack has 1.2 % calcium. The Nature's variety site showed the food I'm also feeding at 1.65 percent. I think you are going to have to go to each individual food's home site to get the info...which I do anyway, before I feed anything.
The pet center. com is a great website, by the way. Really good nutritional info.

[Dianne Carter ~ Trinity Doodles]

Hi Janie, I may be able to offer a few insights in a topic I have tossed out several times here ~ I would reference them but do not recall the precise topic to search. Many are concerned with 'high protein' diets and the purported complications that may result with the kidneys. Of major concern is the quality of protein, add to that calculating what is usable and it is no easy task. Based on some conversations that I have had with developers of foods this is my *opinion*: There are some grain free foods that have considerably high protein contents like Orijen that I take no issue with, the meals that form the recipes are often deboned. There are other well known high protein foods that do not use deboned meat for the protein sources. Of concern here is questionable accuracy in regards to calcium, phosphorus and ash. I question whether it is not this part of the equation that often accompanies *some* high protein formulas that tips the scales on other reported levels. There are a couple of brands that resemble this scenario, to be noted they do not indicate levels of ash and phosphorus on the labeling.

On that note I must apologize and say I will have to return. My eyes and brain are DONE and begging for me to give in to the weight of my eyelids =)

[Janie]

Looking forward to your return.

[Mommy2Max]

Hello!

I'm looking for clarification on adding calcium to a homemade diet. I'm looking to make a no grain limited carb diet of 75% lean meat (rotate protein) and 25% mixed vegetables/fruits - maybe some sweet potatoes or a little grain on occasion but, mainly a no grain homemade diet.

I keep reading a lot of conflicting information regarding calcium/phosphorus ratios as well as sources. I'm almost considering using "Balance It" per my vet's suggestion.

I know this is an important aspect of home prepared meals and honestly, I'm scared to get it wrong.

If I understand correctly the ratios varies from 1:1 to 2:1

According to the AAFCO standards, mentioned in a previous post, it would be 1.7g Calcium per 1,000 calories. Max would need aprox 560mg calcium daily because he eats between 300 and 400 calories.

Dr Becker's (trained under Dr. Pitcairn - if I recall correctly) book "Real Food for Healthy Dogs & Cats" requires 1,070mg calcium per cup of food provided through bone meal.

I've also seen 900mg calcium per pound of food fed and that you really only have to balance the meat since that is what is high in phosphorus.

Another vet requires 250 mg calcium citrate for a 20 pound dog (Max is between 20 and 21 #). Note: she also requires a multi vitamin and perhaps takes that amount of calcium into account.

Another site suggests 1 tsp eggshells (aprox 1,900mg calcium) per pound of food and suggests against bone meal due to it's high phosphorus content.

Dr. Pitcairn's book (third ed) Natural Health for Dogs & Cats has really confused the heck out of me (I'm not a math/number person). The link in the above post seems to suggest Animal Essentials Calcium is the best choice but, pg 67 of his book seems to suggest differently? I think? One of his recipes is calling for aprox. 300mg per cup if using KAL bone meal.

Any thoughts? I'm eaither rightfully confused or I'm just missing something.

Thanks :)

~Danielle

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I have found some of the info in Pitcairn's books to be outdated, and some of it to contradict accepted veterinary knowledge of certain diseases, although that has nothing to do with your question.
If I were going to feed a homecooked diet, and did not want to use vitamin supplements, I would look for advice given by a board-certified veterinary nutritionist. This is a newer specialty, requiring three years post graduate (DVM) work. When I have a chance, I'll research to see if there is a reliable that answers this question.

[Mommy2Max]

Thank you so much!

My other choice is to cook the pre-made frozen raw patties (eggshell - no bone, locally produced under the supervision of a holistic vet) and supplement with a 3.6.9 oil and perhaps a multi. product meets the AAFCO standards - for what that may or may not be worth.

I know that statement is making RAW feeders cringe - sorry!

~Danielle

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

This was a concern of mine when I moved Guinness to a home cooked diet, and one of the key reasons why I waited until he had reached full skeletal growth. I also have not moved Murphy to home cooking, because he is still growing. I'll wait until he's a year old. I feed him either Orijen or Acana and feel comfortable that this is a well balanced diet for a growing puppy. With Guinness, I do use a supplement, and I also give him two tbsp of plain non-fat yogurt daily and ensure that at least a few days a week he is getting a legume as his veggie source. His recent blood work did show that his phosphorus levels were slightly elevated, so I have reduced the supplement and will have him retested at the end of the week.