What Do We Do About Breeder Complaints?

[Adina P]

As you know we only permit breeder recommendations in designated areas, however we have no rules or guidelines about complaints about breeders.  Now and then members post gripes and complaints about breeders they openly name.  This causes stress for the breeder who MAY be wrongly accused...but in either case it is not consistent with our policy on praising breeders.  I am not a fan of excessive moderation and I'd like our site rules to determine what is permitted not my personal judgement about what I think is fair/unfair.  Rule of Law not law of the ruler ... That's what I prefer.  So what do you think?  On the one hand it's good and useful to know if a breeder is not so reputable...on the other hand there are two sides to any story and who really wants to have to come and defend their program on a public forum where things could get ugly.  We are not a courtroom.

Share your thoughts on what a good policy on this is.  What is fair to both breeders and potential buyers?  I don't want to be the clearinghouse of complaints either.

Speak your minds please. 

[Sandi]

On one forum that I belong to (not a Doodle site), one can ask "I'm think about obtaining a puppy from XYZ breeder, does anyone have experience with them?". The responses, both good and bad comments are all done privately.

[Laurie, Fudge, and Vern]

I think they should be made privately, as there are two sides to every story.

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

I think that the words, 'private message me' speaks volumes and anybody with a brain in their head would private message that person to get an opinion. I don't think is it necessarily bad to publicly make a negative comment as long as you don't rant. It should be made clear that this is YOUR opinion based on xyz experience. I am also all for discussions being censored when they get out of hand. I am uncomfortable when a discussion turns negatively abusive and accusatory, but I appreciate hearing (for educational purposes) someone's negative opinion so that I can round out my knowledge. I have formed opinions about breeders that I have 'met' only on this site, but would feel very comfortable getting a sight-unseen puppy from them. One of the things I don't like about another doodle website is that breeders post discussions about their litters and it seems to me that they are often using that site just to sell puppies. I think that the current rules are good ones.

[HeatherA]

What about a review section for breeders where comments are not allowed? Breeder name, state, etc and then a check list of options you can select. Think like if you bought a towel and it didn't allow comments but had static choices like "comfortable" "soft" "fell apart in the wash" and you can check which apply.

A disclaimer should be at the beginning about BUYER beware and a link what to look for in a responsible breeder. I would like to see a FAQ sheet that Doodles aren't for everyone if they are considering buying (much like DRC has) talking about the pros and cons -- grooming needs, training, vet costs, not guaranteed hypoallergenic, coat changes. I would also like to see links to DRC and IDOG to encourage adoption/rescue (any other known rescues - perhaps the Poo-mix rescue as well).

Options could include: (More common issues/compliments could be suggested here)
Did not honor health contract
Honored health contract
Has no written health guarantee
Has written health guarantee under 2 yrs
Has written health guarantee over 2 yrs
Misleading information
Puppy was healthy at first vet check
Puppy was unhealthy at first vet check
Parent(s) on site
Parent(s) not on site
Older dogs on site looked well cared for
Older dogs on site did not look well cared for
Area Puppies are kept was clean
Area Puppies are kept was dirty
Puppies were kept inside
Puppies were kept outside
Allows on site visiting
Does not allow on site visiting
Returned deposit if unable to provide puppy within agreed time
Breeder offers rehome options in contract
Breeder does not offer rehome options in contract
Puppy was fixed prior to receiving
Puppy has fixed contract
Other problems
Other good experiences
I would recommend this breeder
I would not recommend this breeder

This avoids people being able to rant because a breeder was "rude" to them, or they didn't do their homework and were angry at the results.. but still offers a heads up on serious issues.

I also think if there are KNOWN Puppy Mills those should be listed and some kind of article on "Why you shouldn't purchase from a Pet Store or Puppy Mill" All articles should NOT allow comments.

I would like to see us help get good information out there. For the love of Doodles I think we should do our part to help people find good, responsible breeders, understand WHY responsible breeding benefits everyone, understand the pros/cons of Doodle ownership and be aware of the rescue options out there.

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

This is an interesting concept, and it does feel a little more objective to me than just allowing "open comments" about a breeder on the public forum.

[Sarah and Joplin]

I think this is a great, objective idea that leaves any lingering negative emotions out of the equation.

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

Heather I think you have a good suggestion and wonder if it could be sub-grouped under Help in some fashion Like Pros and Cons about Doodles - Choosing a breeder.....

[Laura, Ruby & Sam]

The first place I go when researching something is to the reviews-- on ebay, amazon, and many other sites. I love reviews and think that with marketing as it is these days, reviews from actual customers are often the only credible thing we have.

The horrilbe situation I had with our first (very unhealthy) puppy probably could have been avoided had there been a place I to read the first hand experiences of others with our breeder.

I think businesses are more likely to behavior ethically and uphold high standards of practice when they are keenly aware that their customers will likely "rate" their experience.

That may not be a popular answer, but I'm just being me :).

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

I like this also Laura.

[Tracy L Boring]

Well said Laura.

[Deb, Connor & Simon]

I like Heather's idea. If a breeder has checks by several of the negative things mentioned, it should wave a huge, blaring, red flag to any prospective buyer.
Or you could choose questions with 1-5 star ratings like the way you can vote on favorite photos here in DK....not giving an unhappy buyer the chance to get into a personal attack on the breeder.
I have concerns that providing a forum for negative reviews - with emotion and without restraint - could have possible legal ramifications for the poster.

...just my opinion

[Lindsey, Lee, Whopper and Simba]

I agree that the public forum is not the place for breeder complaints and could get out of hand. Most people who are looking for breeders or ask about them are looking in specific parts of the country. What if there was just a listing for each geographic region with people willing to share their experiences. People with both good and bad experiences in that region or state could provide their name. They could also provide the breeder name there with no positive or negative comments. This will just let people who want to share their bad experiences or who want to promote the great experiences be identified and contacted directly.