Resource guarding food, with a twist

[Amy & Bernie]

Hi all, I've read through the resource guarding posts but I'm wondering if the same thing goes when it's his food?

Bernie just turned 8 months old and very recently started getting 'weird' about his food. Just in the last week when I walk by him eating and run my hand down his pack or give him a pat he tenses up, stops eating, and slowly looks up at me. I think he growled once, not sure.

I want to fix this YESTERDAY and want to know if there's any difference between correcting techniques with toys and with his food?

The twist I mentioned (and maybe this is actually normal) is that when we correct his resource guarding of special bones or toys he becomes a prima donna and won't even look at the bone or toy for at least a day, sometimes multiple days. And this doesn't mean he's recognizing we're in charge, because he goes right back to guarding it when he decides to show interest in it again.This is a whole other problem.

I guess with the food issue, I'm worried it will mess up his eating. I know I could take the 'tough love' approach and figure he'll eat if he's hungry enough, but I'd rather not resort to that if there's a better way.

Thanks!

[Jennifer and Jack]

I know how disheartening it can be when our babies are doing things that are less then desirable.  When Jack was that age and younger he had toy guarding as well as food guarding with other dogs.. Never with me. When he turned one, he started guarding with little tiny kids.. (under two)

 

At the time I was spending a lot of time with my friend who had three doodles. They were all older then Jack and they all learned to eat out of the same bowls etc.

 

When he growled at a small child when they went near his bone, I immediately corrected him firmly. I took his bone away from him. I started having children that I knew take his bones and toys away like crazy. I was holding his collar while they did this and the child was totally safe. Never ever chance a human being bit by a dog.

 

Though Jack never growled over the food with me, I really believe when he is doing that to you he is showing dominance. Like Jack would do with a little kid, he was trying to establish rank. I am not trained enough to offer you the best advice but I will tell you what they told me. Take his food away immediately, as long as you are not in danger of being hurt.  Maybe try hand feeding him and making him sit for each kibble piece he gets. I don't know if he is a big boy or not.

 

I don't believe there is a soul alive that could love their dog more then I love Jack, however, this behavior needs to be nipped in the bud for the dogs own protection. It is not a phase they will grow out of, you have to teach them out of it. With Jack I was really strict with him. Now he will let a small child take away any toy, however, I don't trust him with bones so when small kids are over, all valuables of Jack get taken away.

 

Tough love is the way to go. Don't worry about messing up his eating habits, worry that his guarding is going to get worse.

He is so young and that is great. He will learn fast. I also was told to do training with him daily to reestablish his rank, which is below any human being. I would make him sit, stay, come constantly. I gave him commands that he needed to follow.

 

Also, other ideas are to make him sit before you feed him the bowl of food, make sure once you get this under control that you often put your hand in his bowl mid feeding, you can take away the bowl and put it back down, touch him etc. I am to the point with Jack that when he is eating his food, I can tell him to drop it and he will spit it out.

 

When Jack was 8 months old, I was scared to death because he was being so guarding. The great news is training these babies is easy if you are consistent and show them you are in charge

 

Good luck and don't lose heart.

[Amy & Bernie]

Thank you so much! I gotta tell you, even hearing other people go through the same "issues" makes me feel that much better. Lots of good advice here. Bernie better be ready for a stricter meal routine until we get this under control! Luckily we're starting some additional behavior/obedience classes very soon so that should help reaffirm pack order as well, the timing couldn't be better. Thanks again Jennifer!

[Adina P]

Resource guarding is a tough, confusing issue for me.  Different trainers with different philosophies approach it differently.

On the one hand I can take anything from my dogs.  And I want it to always be that way.  I think via basic obedience training and daily interaction and setting boundaries and being consistent you can establish your right to all goods in the house. At the same time, my trainer believes that you shouldn't take stuff from dogs (like food) for the sake of taking stuff.  Or bother them excessively while they eat for the sake of 'practice'.  She compares it to how you'd feel if someone consistently came by while you were eating and picked up your plate...even if they always gave it back...eventually you'd be pretty irritated about it and want it to just STOP. 

So my non-professional opinion is that taking an obedience approach to leadership--putting in the time in training to establish your leadership and relationship so the dog thinks you have the RIGHT to tell him what to do and take anything away is the best way to go.  And in the meantime, let him eat in peace.  But again, there are varied opinions on this.

[Amy & Bernie]

I can see where your trainer is coming from Adina. I feel like such a bully taking Bernie's special bones and toys when he gets possessive because I feel like he doesn't understand why I'm doing it. Especially since it has yet to sink in despite multiple rounds of correction over the last few months. Then, every time I approach him when he's enjoying something he tenses up, like "she likes to take things from me". And tense leads to guarding, and we're going around and around again.

Since it's just my husband and me in the home we could, in theory, let him eat and chew bones in peace, but like Jennifer addressed, I refuse to let him act like that if someone is watching him or if we have children some day.

I wish there was a way to ensure he knew WHY I was correcting him when he's guarding. He's getting much better about "give" so perhaps I need to incorporate that more when correcting his guarding, he's figuring out not giving is wrong, so if he doesn't "give" his special bone when I ask, or "give" me access to his dish, the correction will make more sense?

[Leann Harris]

Amy- you're on the right track. Correcting your dog out of the blue (how he's going to see it) just causes him to not trust you. Who wants to break their dog's trust? Corrections never build trust, that's for sure! lol

So what you're doing is good! What you're doing is the beginning of the "exchange game". It's where you have something the dog wants, the dog has something the dog wants, and you practice "give" so that he *trusts* that he'll get stuff. But you start with a low value item- like a toilet paper roll, or a crumpled up piece of paper. Something the dog has no interest in and is going to look at you like "Really  mom? What do you want me to do with THAT?" . Just practice give with those items, then you might up your criteria by smearing peanut butter on it, or move to a slightly more exciting item. Do not move up to the items he guards for at least 30 days of playing "the exchange game". Once your dog thinks this is just a game, give no longer is a big deal!

The "Mine!" book has this and other protocals in it that build trust and the relationship up with your dog...

 

Good luck!

[Adina P]

I'm not saying you should never correct...but I'm not clear myself on how to correct for guarding. 

Is his obedience impeccable?  IF not that would be MY first thought: Let's work on his overall obedience to make it excellent!  And that would include a lot of work on 'drop it' or 'give' or whatever.  So you can call him to you: "Bernie, COME!"  He would then come to you regardless of what he's chewing on.  Then you could give him the 'Give' or "Drop it" command and he would.  I wouldn't do this 'in the heat of the moment' but work on the obedience separately and reduce the high value toys in the meantime.  Maybe save them for later for obedience practice after he's really solid on giving up other stuff.  Then YES you could correct for him not obeying the 'give' command.  I wouldn't want to invent the correction.  I'd want to work with a trainer or a written method of some type that took me through the teaching and the correction from start to finish.

 

I disagree that corrections cause a loss of trust. I trained my Rosco using praise and corrections and although we never made it to our goal of complete off leash obedience (I lost motivation after training for SOOO long on my own), he only trusted me MORE and became a better companion.  Corrections, used fairly, and consistently (very important) build trust because the dog knows exactly what to expect.  The dog knows you are a solid rock and will not waiver from your expectations and will always be fair and impartial and your response will always be the same.  That includes praise for good behavior.  

 

However, I'm personally not clear on the type of corrections to use for guarding and when and how and what the follow up should be. 

[Amy & Bernie]

You're right Adina, we're getting him back in obedience classes asap. He's very good in calm energy situations but he's not reliable if he feels he's being "punished" or if he knows he's doing something wrong. He's also unpredictable on walks, jumping up, etc. so it's back to school!

I believe if I'm in charge and he knows his place in the pack he'll trust me. I'm just trying to sort out the right way to get there.

I appreciate the different perspectives because if anything it helps me make sense of what I'm potentially dealing with!

[Leann Harris]

Have you read the book "Mine!" by Jean Donaldson? Or "Culture Clash"? I would STRONGLY recommend you consult with a professional trainer who is trained in animal behavior. Start with this article http://ahimsadogtraining.com/blog/resource-guarding/

The behavior you're describing (the "not interested for a day until he decides he's interested") is what's to be expected in using suppression (rather than training). "Corrections" are suppressive- they stop the behavior, but it does not train the dog what *to* do. There are behavior protocals which are used to successfully work on any form of resource guarding, whether it's food, toys, people, etc.

While I understand what you're trying to convey when people say "the dog is showing dominance", applying labels like that to a whole range of behavior doesn't normally lead to a mindset that actually gets to why the dog is resource guarding. You may want to read some articles to help get you in the right mindset for solving the problem rather than correcting the symptom - http://sites.google.com/site/petsboardfaqs/home/training-and-behavi... , or http://www.dogwelfarecampaign.org/why-not-dominance.php

 

If you talk to a trainer, or at least read "Mine!" there are some very easy to do behavior protocals that will get to the root of the problem.At the very least, starting a "Nothing In Life is Free" (NILF) program should help immediatly!

 

Good luck! Feel free to ask if you need help finding resources...

 

-leann

[Amy & Bernie]

Thanks for all the input Leann. The exchange game will be our new MO! What you describe sounds like my situation with Bernie, I'm stopping him "in the moment" but it's not producing the result I want for the long haul.

I'll definitely check out the articles and fortunately we'll be back in obedience class within the week so I'll have access to some trainers.

[Leann Harris]

Good luck! I know how scarry it can be!! I had a resource guarder myself. She guarded EVERYTHING, including our bed, the floor, a room, me, food- you name it. After about 2 years she bacame a therapy dog and lived out her life being sweet and kind to residents in homes- so I know it can be done! It's what caused me to study animal behavior and become a trainer...

So just think of everything you'll get to learn from her! Congrats! :)

[Allyson, Peri & Taquito]

I didn't read through all the responses and honestly have not had a problem with Peri on this one.  Mainly because we have done a lot of training and I make her sit, wait, etc... for her food, treats, basically anything she wants. I literally put her food down and make he sit-stay for a few seconds. Then I say "good girl! take it!" and she knows it is her cue to eat.  I think psychologically it makes her know that it is not "hers" unless I tell her it's okay and she can have it.  Start trying that technique also...

[Amy & Bernie]

That's the extra frustrating thing Allyson, he's really good with sit, stay, come, shake, etc. and getting much much better at give. And my husband and I both agree that "nothing is free". He earns pretty much everything other than rump scratches! He waits for his food, in a sit, like you mentioned, waits for the "okay dinner!" signal before eating. It's just so bizarre that out of nowhere (seemingly) he's gotten weird about his food. I just wish he could tell me why! I appreciate your input, and I think you're totally right, we're looking into some more tricks to continue challenging him in regards to what earns treats and such.