Dominant Dogs....Do They Ever Change?

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

As you all know, Murphy is a real challenge.  He is very pushy and his overall "personality" is dominant.  He is always testing, and spends every waking minute trying to figure out how to take over the house.  We have him on a pretty "tight leash" because of this....he has to earn everything and I correct every time I see him display dominance.  It's a full time job, but as a result he is now usually real good around the house, and the bullying of Guinness is under control.  The thing is I have to watch him like crazy, because that underlying mindset is always there....he's just looking for me to slip up.  Outside the house is a whole different story, and we are still dealing with his on leash reactiveness to some dogs.  I can take him on 10 walks and he'll do fine, and then on the eleventh walk something will set him off and the results are a disaster.  That's a whole different discussion though.  My real question is do dogs like this ever really change?  Will he be like this forever, and will we constantly have to manage his environment to the degree we do now?  We had a real bad dominance incident yesterday, and so now he's on "lock down" again.  He knows that I'm in no mood for him to push it so he's "tiptoeing" around me.  But I know him, and he'll be right back testing again....probably by this afternoon.  I've asked my trainer this, and he just keeps saying that all dogs are different and "lets not get too ahead of ourselves".  So, I'm just wondering if anyone has had experience with a dog like Murphy, and did it change as the dog got older?  Please say yes.

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

On Friday, when Murphy "reacted" to a dog on one of our training walks he knocked me down...flat on my back.  This was the most serious reaction yet.

[Carol Brand]

That makes me angry!  What a brat! (Sorry, but it is true.)   

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

He's not really a brat....although he does do some "bratty things".  I think he's just a dog with some issues and he needs me to do a better job at helping him to get past those problems.  I think you're right that it's "hard wired", but I just can't give up on him.  I'll keep working and maybe things will get more manageable.

[Jennifer,Chloe & Myla]

I'm sorry this happened to you-I know it's frustrating, I'm just glad you are ok!!! Maybe Murph and Myla can get together for a dominance treat-she will not leave Chloe be AT ALL!!

[Adina P]

Maybe it's time to add in Open exercises into Murphy's routine.  Gain control of his mouth and what he does when he leaves your side.  If you have to continue training for a while anyway, worth a shot!

[Joanne ~ Spud*]

What would these exercises consist of?

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

I have the same question.  I'm thinking it's about retrieving, right?

[Adina P]

Carol posted in a prior discussion all the parts of Open.  The trainers I know see Open as one of the best things to do with a difficult dog.  Once you gain control of their mouth and teach the dog to do things at a distance you gain more control and the dog learns better self control.  Because the retrieve is NOT a game when they train, it's work and the dog learns he ALWAYS has to retrieve ANYTHING asked of him from distances and with distractions in his way.  So it's not a matter of toss a ball and play, but real 'work'.  That's what the trainers I talk to and learn from believe--of course this is done in a very systematic way that builds on the method they use so I don't know if it works as effectively otherwise.  Seems worth exploring though! 

The other thing I was thinking as I'm brainstorming is what is Murphy's job?  He's learned all the basic commands and he seems to be able to do them well around distractions most of the time.  However, once a dog knows how to do something pretty well just merely doing those things over and over and over will bore a dog.  He needs to be challenged.  Calmness and self control WHILE doing these things are side effects of proofing and training.  Perhaps Murphy needs a REAL job...something that he considers worthy of his time and until that is found it will only be about 'calmness' which is not a job he's after but a goal of yours (as a normal human who wants a more relaxed and calm dog).   He might need a different job than 'merely' walking nicely in a park.  But I dunno what that might be.

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

I think you make a great point, Adina.  I've signed him up for Agility Training in January.  Guinness is going to do Flyball, but the trainer and I thought that would not be the best choice for Murph right now.  We think Agility (part on leash and part off) will be best for him right now.  The thing that is so strange about Murph is how situational this reactiveness is.  We do our formal obedience practice sessions three times a week, and he is great.  Once a week we do our off leash obedience work with Ben, and again he is great.  We are fine tuning a few things, but for the most part he is impressive to watch.  On most of our daily proofing walks, he's also doing fine. We just can't figure out what is going on with him with these totally crazy reactions to certain dogs.  When he's in this state, his strength is incredible and he is impervious to my corrections.  We'll begin some new correction strategies on Tuesday, so we'll have to wait and see.

[Sharon & Monty]

I had a golden retriever that exhausted me.  When she reached age 2 I wondered why in the hell doesn't this dog settle down?  She would never stop jumping nor running  and running away........Not anything I was used to after having several dogs during my lifetime.  I happened to be a smoker at the time so huge amounts of exercise was not in my vocabulary.  I started walking my dog, a half mile at a time.  Didn't take long for me to realize I was a wimp and needed to up the ante.  I stopped smoking and started on 2 miles at a time.  She loved it, would come home, flop on the floor and 10 minutes later would jump up and ask "now what are we gonna do, huh, huh, pant, pant, pace, pace"  We would play ball, take another walk, etc. She did eventually get better, but I think more slowly than could have been as I never had real help from the family nor any family members that visited us.  My father in law always brought treats and ask her to jump up on his chest.....sigh.  Everything that she should not do.  As I understand now, I believe my dog was from a Field Dog golden line.  My current guy is from and English Golden from across the pond, and is of a different temperament and is almost lazy.  My Xena did get better, but it took a few years.  As they say, I don't know nothing about birthing babies, but maybe more exercise?  It was helpful for my golden.  The more I exercised her, the better,   How about running Murphy up and down the steps (provided of course they are carpeted or whatever for footing) Perhaps he just has so much energy in him, he really doesn't know what to do with it and causes problems cause he is looking for something to do?  Hang in there Jane!

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

Thanks Sharon.  That's part of the new plan.  He's going on the treadmill with a backpack (loaded) for an hour before walks.  That's only part of the new strategy.  We started the treadmill process today.  Because he was pretty loaded down he only made it through 30 minutes before he started panting.  The trainer will be here on Tuesday...we'll treadmill him first...then take him out with some new strategies.

[Sharon & Monty]

I have a feeling that your new plan is gonna be a cure.  I know that you have done and tried everything in the book or so it seems.  Seriously, we had to work our dog, like a working dog........  ha ha, as they are.  An entire hour of treadmill?  wow.  Hey do what you gotta do, do it enough that he doesn't hate ya!  lol  Best wishes!  Waiting to hear of your success,