Labradoodle & Goldendoodle Forum
Worried - Persistent Tummy Issues
Who else has delt with persistent tummy problems? This is the longest we've had issues, and we've hit two weeks now. I'm stumped and not sure of where to go from here. Vet thinks he ate something funny, but we're now going on two weeks of this.
9/4 - new food bag opened
9/11 - heartgard given (no prior issues with this)
9/12 - stool softening slightly
9/13 - loose stools
9/14 - completely loose stools, every 2hrs through the night
9/15 - vet visit & negative fecal test. Given 7 day course of metronidazole and 3 days of pro pecatlin, switched to bland chicken/rice. First stool again on 9/18, normal and remains normal while on pro pectalin.
9/22 - normal stool followed immediately by a loose one
9/23 - normal stools
9/24 - loose stools every 30min at 4am :(
9/25 - loose stools every 2hrs throughout the night.
It does seem like we'll have a normal stool, and then just a little while later a very loose stool (IBS?). Energy levels are normal, but he does seem hungrier than usual. Leading up to this there have been no changes to food, treats or routine (Oliver had done well on Fromms Four Star Surf & Turf). Oliver gets a Providable DC probiotic once daily, and pumpkin doesn't help.
The stool test was negative for giardia and other parasites. We're taking another one in today in case it was just missed. Could this be an intolerance to food - maybe time to change formulas/protein sources? IBS? I'm stumped and really worried about my poor fuzzy boy.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle on
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Jaime, we have a lot of info on these issues in the Health & Medical Group, and the Food Group. LOTS of our dogs suffer from digestive issues.
One thing I want to mention is what IBS actually is, and the difference between IBS and IBD, because there is a lot of confusion about these terms.
IBS is Irritable Bowel Syndrome, and it's basically a nervous stomach. There are no tests for it, and treatment mainly consists of dietary management. Dogs with IBS have periods of unexplained diarrhea and usually do best on limited ingredient diets with a lot of water content, like Honest Kitchen or home-cooked food. IBS is not serious.
IBD on the other hand stands for Inflammatory Bowel Disease and it is serious indeed. It is an immune-mediated incurable disease of the intestinal lining, and it is a real female dog to diagnose and treat. IBD causes malnutrition, vitamin deficiencies, and can be life-threatening. It doesn't sound like Oliver has IBD, but as long as we're talking about GI conditions, I thought it would be helpful to clarify terms.
You really never want to give metronidazole without a very good reason. More than one doodle owner here is dealing with on-going digestive issues due to repeated (and unwarranted) courses of metronidazole. Vets prescribe it as if it were a benign diarrhea medicine, but it's not. It can cause major bacterial imbalances in the gut, which then cause ongoing diarrhea. I'm glad you are using probiotics, that's crucial whenever a dog is on metro.
Even if a dog tests positive for giardia, you really want Panacur, not metro.
You might have your vet run another fecal; giardia has a 10-14 day incubation period and the cysts don't show up in every sample. Oliver's symptoms do sound like he might have gotten giardia. Having to go every two hours plus diarrhea is indicative of more than a food issue, it sounds like a parasite or a bacterial issue.
You could try rotating to another Fromm Four-Star formula with a different protein source, something he hasn't eaten on a regular basis in the past. Maybe lamb or pork?
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Permalink Reply by Jaime + Oliver on
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Thanks - Good to know about IBS vs IBD. My first thought was giardia so I was really surprised when it came back negative. I'm going to keep pushing the vet here because I don't like the idea of Metro either.
Oliver was itching a lot a few weeks ago (when we had a dusty yard), but now I'm wondering if that was an indication of allergies? I know digestive allergies present themselves in several ways, but do they take a while to appear? Like if Oliver has been on the same formula for 6 months, is it possible to "build up" over an extended period of time?
You'll love this too - vet wanted us to give us Hills Rx. I opted for boiled chicken & rice instead :) In hindsight now, once we had transitioned back to 100% kibble the issues started up again. Hm.
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The homemade food helped because of the very high moisture content and the very bland, very limited, highly digestible ingredients, not because the kibble is causing the problem.
Food allergies always take a long time to develop; typically, the dog has been eating the same proteins repeatedly for a minimum of six months and more commonly a year or two. And you would be seeing the itching day in and day out.
I know that people always want to blame food for allergies (and everything else), but actual food allergies are relatively rare. Here's some info on food allergies.
http://www.doodlekisses.com/group/thefoodgroup/forum/topics/facts-a...
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Super informative, as always Karen! This education makes conversations with vets so much more effective. Oliver does itch a lot, but it worsened a few weeks ago. I had just assumed it was seasonal allergies/dust and it sounds like that's the case. Still, after 6 months on this formula its time to change formulas/protein sources!
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Permalink Reply by Kaitee and Orwell on
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I would maybe try a different food, but it could be IBS. Keep bugging the vet about it.
In the meantime, make him brown rice for every meal and just a little bit of kibble mixed in. Once you see improvement, start decreasing the amount of rice you give him.
Rice is easy on the tummy and he should be able to digest it normally.
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Actually, I wouldn't use any rice, since he is on a grain-free diet.
The homemade bland diet that has worked best for many of our dogs with diarrhea is a 50/50 mix of finely cut plain boiled white meat chicken and plain mashed sweet potatoes. The sweet potatoes are easier to digest than rice and provide soluble fiber to help with stool formation.
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Will use this as our bland option now instead of rice!
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Good to know. Is there a reason why many people use sweet potatoes as opposed to brown, red or white potatoes?
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Permalink Reply by J and Riley (and Luna) on
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More nutritious and higher in fiber :) Some stats from Google (per 100g)
White potato:
Calories 69 Potassium 407 mg 11% Dietary fiber 2.4 g 9% Vitamin A 0% Vitamin C 15% Calcium 0% Iron 2% Vitamin D 0% Vitamin B-6 10% Vitamin B-12 0% Magnesium 5%
Yams (orange sweet potatoes)
Calories 118 Potassium 816 mg 23% Dietary fiber 4.1 g 16%
Vitamin A 2% Vitamin C 28% Calcium 1% Iron 2% Vitamin D 0% Vitamin B-6 15% Vitamin B-12 0% Magnesium 5%
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Well, this is partly true. But sweet potatoes are not yams. They are from a different family of root vegetables and are lower in calories and some nutrients than yams.
However, they're not potatoes, either.
Sweet potatoes are very different nutritionally than brown, red or white potatoes. They are not even in the same family of plants. Sweet potatoes are lower in starches, carbohydrates, and calories, much higher in vitamins, and much, much higher in soluble fiber.
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Ohh… I forgot that they were something completely different. I hate sweet potatoes, so I've tried not to think about them much. :P
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Permalink Reply by Karen & Maple on
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Not saying this is THE solution for you, but I put Maple Proviable KP paste this week in addition to her regular Proviable DC. It seemed to really do the trick. She did eat something she shouldn't have-excrement. Had vomiting, dehydration followed by diarrhea with blood. Fecal was negative. She was on a bland diet once the vomiting stopped, but she continued to have loose stool with blood. It wasn't until about 12 hrs after giving the KP paste when her stool firmed up and no more bleeding. Thank goodness! I plan on slowly mixing in her regular food today. I hope you find some answers and your fur baby gets better soon.
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