What REAL European Moyen Poodles look like

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

A dear friend and my go-to person for everything Poodle posted this in our FB Poodle group. I hope the video link works.
Here are her comments on the videos:

Just wanted to share videos I saw recently of this lovely Moyen Poodle in Slovakia. He is 39cm which equals around 15.4"

Great dog, I'd love to have one like him (look at his cute attitude!) but I also want people to see what size real European Moyens actually are. In type, temperament, and health issues, Moyens are the same variety as our US Miniatures.

Moyen seems to be the new breeding buzz word and people are using it for all manner of dogs that they are churning out. Two days ago, I saw someone offering a Toy stud for use as a "moyen" breeding dog and I saw another breeder advertising a litter of regular Standards as moyens.

Buyer beware.

Me again.

"Moyen" Poodles are NOT created by breeding a Standard Poodle with a Miniature or Toy Poodle.

However, this is what you are getting with most American bred "Moyen" Poodles, including those used by doodle breeders.
It's important to be aware that the temperaments and genetics of Standard Poodles are different from those of Miniatures, and both are different from those of Toys. There are genetic diseases that run in Standards but not in the smaller size Poodles, and vice versa. When you mix size lines, you create lines that can potentially have ALL of the genetic diseases that all three size Poodles can carry. 

It is a very dangerous and foolish thing to do. 
Before buying a doodle puppy who has a "Moyen" parent, I would ask to see the pedigree. AKC registrations include the dog's size classification (Standard, Miniature, Toy abbreviated as S, M or T) and it will be easy to know if this "Moyen" is indeed the product of the breeding of two different size Poodles.
If that is the case, and you still want to buy the puppy, you need to check the health clearances very carefully for all of the genetic diseases known to run in both sizes. 

https://www.facebook.com/petra.vyhlidkova.5/videos/pcb.222704180397...

https://www.facebook.com/petra.vyhlidkova.5/videos/pcb.222704180397...

And here's a photo:

[Stacy]

I am always late to the party!

[J and Riley (and Luna)]

They look really similar to a chocolate labradoodle to me.  

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I lied, she had two:

https://doodlekisses.com/photo/pippin-1?context=user
https://doodlekisses.com/photo/phantom-1?context=user

[Stacy]

They don't look quite the way I thought they would. I am really starting to become partial to the whole poodle. 

I took Maggie to the dog training club meeting tonight and there was a lady there who I think would have kidnapped her if I would have let her. She's looking for an ESA. I know DRC doesn't adopt to people wanting service animals, but how do they feel about emotional support animals? 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Funny you ask. Jacquie posted a wonderful article in the FB DRC group last week that addresses this very issue.
http://sighthoundunderground.com/http/this-is-not-your-dog/?fbclid=...

From the blog:
Occasionally we will receive an application from someone who wants an emotional support dog or service dog. Again, I explain to them that is not what we do. We are not here to support you. We are here to support them.
The relationships that we make when we match dogs to humans are not balanced and that is by design. I am not looking for an adopter who will love Petina as much as she loves them. What I am trying to find for Petina is someone who will love her ten times more than she loves them. She needs someone who will love her when she's pouting because breakfast is ten minutes late. She needs someone who will love her if she gets stressed out during a thunderstorm and poops on their floor.
Pettina needs An Emotional Support Human. 

That pretty much sums up DRC's (and my) feelings about rescue dogs as ESAs. or as I used to tell potential adopters, "We want people who want to do something for a dog, not who want a dog to do something for them." 

[Stacy]

That's what I thought, I just didn't want to speak out of turn without being sure. I agree with it too. I can't imagine how disappointed someone looking for an ESA would have been when Maggie first came home. Our relationship looks really easy now, but we both worked really hard to get where we are. There were tears and frustration. It was nothing like bringing home a dog with no baggage. 

Now I will say that we do support one another. She makes me more outgoing. I have to be. People stop me on the street to talk about her. But it would have been so unfair to bring her home with the idea that she was going to meet my needs. As challenging as it was, I wouldn't change anything about it. I think it made our bond so much stronger to have fought through and come out the other side. But I don't think it would be fair to Maggie to expect her to support someone else. She's already gone through the hard stuff. Now she can just sit back and be the princess. The princess who gets so comfy on the couch that she rolls over and falls off! I love this girl.

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

I love following your conversations!  The two weimerdoodles are gorgeous; it changed my opinion from what I thought they’d look like.  Moyen poodle would be the perfect size—- errrrrr Ned’s size :-)

What you’ve accomplished with Maggie is to be envied. She is so lucky that you adopted her and made her a princess. Of course she deserves it, but only you saw the princess inside. 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

We had a slide show many years back with an "unusual colors" theme, and there are quite a few silver-looking doodles in it:
https://doodlekisses.com/photo/albums/doodles-of-unusual-colors?xgi...

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Okay, I did some reading, and silver (in Poodles at least) is recessive. Two silver can't produce anything darker than silver. They can produce silver beige if there is cream, white, brown, or silver beige in the lines. 

[J and Riley (and Luna)]

Makes sense to me, most of those "faded" colours (in mammals in general) seem to be recessive.

Poodles come in so many colours!

[Stacy]

I thought I had read that somewhere. Unfortunately the site I was reading about color genetics seems to have bitten the dust. It was an old site anyway. But it makes sense to me because Jasper's breeder seemed to be very certain that all the puppies would be silver. Silver dogs should only make silver puppies - at least some shade of silver. It also makes sense that silver would be a rare doodle color. It shouldn't come from the poodle side since it's a recessive gene and shouldn't be able to express itself without another poodle silver gene that the golden/lab presumably wouldn't have. I know that color genes are a lot more complicated than punnett squares, but from a high school biology standpoint I get it. 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Here are some photos of Jasper's oversized brother and sister. Now, I realize most of us don't like the shaved faces on Poodles. But you have to admit, these Poodles have really pretty faces. Not all do.
Sister Audrey:

Brother Winston: