F1 GD vs. F2 GD

[Missi]

I'm just starting my hunt for a puppy and have found a breeder in my area who has both F1 Goldedoodles and F2 Goldedoodles. For those of you who have worked with both have you noticed any general differences? Any higher incidences of illnesses/behavior problems? I've found loads of information on F1's and F1b's, but not F2's. Is that just because there aren't a whole lot of them out there yet? Please help!

[Adina P]

So this breeder is breeding F1 to an F1? Just checking because sometimes F1b's are also called F2.
If it were me I would NOT get an F2. Nothing WRONG with that generation except that the litter of an F1 x F1 (of ANY breed) will yield a HUGE variety. Some will be VERY poodley, some VERY retriever-ish, and some in between. The variation is bigger than any other possible mix--more of a crapshoot. So your choices may be limited once the litter is born. In other words if you want a middle of the road dog (as far as looks) there may be fewer to choose from in the litter.

Be SURE the breeder tests for hips, eyes at a minimum and if you read the forum discussion started recently on "blood clotting..." you'll also want to see evidence the parents were tested for VWD and you get a good health guarantee!

[Missi]

Yes it is an F1 to an F1 and she has a good health guarantee. I'll check up on the genetic testing. Thanks for the input!

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I'm with Adina...if what is being called an F2 is a breeding between two F1's, that is not a recommended breeding practice. Genetically, such a breeding would yield 40% pure-bred poodles, 40% pure-bred retrievers, and only 20% true F2 hybrids. See IDOG's explanation below:

http://idog.biz/TheRightPuppy.html

[Park Mom]

We just finished our puppy shopping for a Labradoodle. This is an interesting question. We found some people with allergies (like we do) urging us to buy a very poodle-coated F1b. But the more research we did, the more we liked the appearance and temperment that you get with the "multigens" (which I believe means F3 or higher) with true Australian blood lines. We also found that most breeders who offered early generation crosses are aiming to get to the "multigen" stage of things as soon as possible, so there must be some reason for that.

I would just urge you to consider looking about a bit farther from home. Many breeders have a lot of experience getting your pup to you in a humane way (ours has an employee who is going to fly with our puppy in the people cabin from Maine to NYC). Or you could find a breeder within a day's drive or so, and make puppy pick-up into a fun weekend!

Good luck!

[Adina P]

I have to admit that my preference for F1's would probably lead me to create a multigen by doing F1 x F1 x F1 type breedings picking out the BEST of each and breeding the unrelated ones together. It is NOT the going way to breed because the general breeding community of doodle breeders aim for nonshedding higher generation doodles. Whereas I prefer the F1 look and would love to breed an F1 looking dog that bred true. That said...it would take an insanely long time to do so. So my babbling is meant to say that it is NOT common to breed F1 x F1, but it's not wrong, it just isn't common. That would make me do a double take if I met a breeder that DID do that kind of breeding, but it doesn't make the breeder wrong or bad or the litter wrong or bad...it is just that statistically the litters don't come out very similar. So it's a statistical issue ... and as in all statistics sometimes things turn out GREAT as far as uniformity of coats...but the probability is lower.

To make a long winded post shorter =) IF this breeder does all the testing and has a great health guarantee, raises puppies well...and you can find a pup with the type of coat you want...great! Go for it!

No matter what we'll welcome your new pup!

[Missi]

Thank you everyone for your replies! I did decide to go with an F1 pup from this same breeder, as I've seen pictures of grown doodles from the exact pair and they are perfect!. She does do all the genetic testing (I asked yesterday!) and also tests for skin and ear problems on her breeding dogs. Her health guarantee wouldn't make me return the dog either, but offers a refund instead up to 2 years. So I think I've covered all the bases.... The puppies are raised in the hosue and she has a million references of happy families. The puppies are due in early November, so I should have a new family member in early January! YAY!!!!

[Adina P]

Sounds great! Congrats and we'll be eagerly anticipating the homecoming!

[Sue, Murphy and Bella ()*o*()]

Would you mind sharing the breeders website? Thanks

[Missi]

www.mywhatadoodle.com
The woman's name is Sharon Williams.

[Oliver]

I'm going to go ahead and agree with what most of the others have posted...For me, the main thing would be grooming. If you end up getting more of a poodley F2 dog, it would require much more CONSTANT brushing and grooming to prevent horrible mats compared to most of the wavy/shaggy F1s.