F1b vs. Multi Gen

[Kate Dawson]

I was originally looking for an F1b golden doodle but a lot of the breeders in my area are moving to multi-gens. I know multi-gens are more hypo allergenic but can anyone explain the differences in looks and personality? Is it better to have 3/4 poodle and 1/4 golden or  a mix of 2 golden doodles? Which is preferable? Thanks.

[Adina P]

I think the most important thing to remember is that you can't generalize about doodles.  Statistically, an F1b would have more poodle.  But in any F1b litter there may still be some that don't fit that mold and are more retriever like, because it is a mixed breed and there will be variation.  A multigen is also still a mixed breed.  A good, experienced breeder who spends a lot of time with the pups will probably be able to make a better guess about coat and shedding if that is a critical factor.  But no dog is truly hypoallergenic so a certain generation or type of doodle isn't necessarily 'more' hypoallergenic than another.  You have a 100% guarantee that a poodle won't shed.  But when you mix a poodle with a shedding dog, there is still the possibility that the shedding genes get passed down.  If the multigens you are seeing are F1s bred to F1s then that is the biggest gamble.  But if they are F1b and F2's bred to each other then that's probably okay and it comes down to preference.  What are the parents like?  What have previous litters of those parents been like?

[Lucy & AnnaBelle's Mom]

My understanding of the multi-gen is that if it is two goldendoodles then one must be an F1B or a multi-gen so you wouldn't have two F1 parents for a multi-gen?  Other way would be a Multi-gen bred back to a poodle! 

[Adina P]

I only said the F1 x F1 bit just in case :-)  But yes, I agree... F1 x F1 is not really a multigen, though someone could use such a step toward multigen by choosing the most 'doodley' pup from a litter of F1 x F1.  However, since that combo gets such a variety of outcomes, it is not a good one for placing pups since there might be lots of retrieverish pups.

[Kaytlin and Cooper]

id say multi gens are more predictable in size and coat....

[Jennifer Tramell]

I have noticed that many "multi-gens" are basically f1bs.  What I mean by this is that a f1b is USUALLY a 50/50 goldendoodle bred back to a poodle (occasionally they are bred back to a golden), with the resulting puppies being 75% poodle.  Many multi-gens are the result of a f1b bred to a f2b, or something similar, and the puppies still end up being 75% poodle.  If you are concerned about an allergy friendly dog, a 75% poodle goldendoodle is probably your best choice.  Personally, a multi-gen produced from selectively breeding low-shedding 50/50 goldendoodles would be my choice because I like keeping a higher percentage of golden retriever, but, if allergies are a concern, I'd stick with 75% poodle.

[Allyson, Peri & Taquito]

I agree with Jennifer's comments. Peri's breeder is doing more mult-gens now and they do tend to look more poodly.  I happen to prefer more golden-50/50ish.

If allergies are a huge concern, remember there is NO guarantee a labradoodle or goldendoodle of ANY generation will be low to non-shedding as Adina states above.

[Karen Kennedy]

Have you considered an Australian Labradoodle. Bred to be people dogs and there are associations that regulate the breeders to make sure you are getting healthy puppies. They were originally bred in Australia for service dogs so they used the Labrador because the Lab has less health issues then the Golden Retriever. Anyway, they are very nice dooodles, check out the ALAA or the ALCA below:

http://alaa-labradoodles.com/

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

I may be way off here but my understanding is that you need to get to 4th+ generation  to get more consistency in the doodle 'look' and shed departments.  I think in generations 2 and 3, you are quite as likely to get lots of retriever genes.

[Mustard Seed Ranch]

As a breeder( GANA Member Breeder) let me shed some light on , this:

A multigen would be a puppy with one parent being an F3 or higher. The coats of a multigen litter are going to be very similar to those of an F1b, meaning some curly and some wavy...It depends upon the parents involved. Certain pairings will generate more curly, some more wavy, it depends on what the breeder is trying to achieve. In personality or temperment it is the same. It is still a combination of ONLY Golden retriever and Poodle, at least if the Breeder is GANA registered. The way I kind of explain it to my clients is that its a way to introduce more retriever genes without sacrificing the Non shedding factor.

As far as percentage wise, the F1 IS 50/50, but after that you can not say for certain without doing a DNA test....AND at some point in the line there ceases to be Golden and Poodle genes and the genes "fuse" together to create Goldendoodle genes or what would show up as OTHER on a DNA test. For example Australian Labradoodles show up as mostly OTHER.

As far as the Shedding factor, An F1b used to be the best chance of Non shedding followed by the Multigen, however now that there is a test for the "shedding gene" in multigens you will find that it will no longer be the case. Because of the creation of this test I presume more breeders will move forward with multigens and you will see less F1b's.

As far as the health of an F1b versus a Multigen, same testing requiremements are involved. In either mix you need to test for ALL conditions (testeable) that BOTH Goldens AND Poodles carry.

 

Hope that makes sense. 

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

Thanks for posting this right under my post so I was sure to find it.  I find genetics fascinating. Thanks for enlightening me.

[Sylvia and Malley]

We have an F1B.  Her mom was and a standard chocolate poodle and her dad was a black goldendoodle..  Our Malley is now 3 - she does not shed.  Sometimes I see hair dust bunnies - but I see dust bunnies anyway.  : )  Malley's bedding is white and there are no hairs on it.  The best judge for me - I can kiss her head full on with lip gloss on and get nothing on my lips.  She weights 68 lbs now and is truly the most gentle sweetest dog we have ever had.  She is ghosting - which we love.