Torn CCL

[Jarka, Monty & Auggie]

It seems that after several visits at a canine rehab center, the vets have settled on a diagnosis of a partially torn ACL. I got the call on Saturday and I'm still trying to process the information.

Here is how it all started:

http://www.doodlekisses.com/group/healthandmedicalissues/forum/topi...

So today I made an appointment for a consultation with an ortho specialist. It's this Friday.

I'm so confused and scared about all of this. Is surgery always the only option? How do they even know for sure it's a torn ACL? What do I need to ask the ortho specialist?

I'm having a hard time envisioning the post surgery time. Even now, I was told Monty should take it easy and not run or jump. So our daily outings to a dog park are out of the window. We went for a mile long walk this morning, which does not nearly cut it for both active boys. I worry that Auggie loses a chance to burn more energy while following Monty's calm regiment now. It's really hard to do that.

And if surgery is the only option, it would mean that I will need to take some time off work to be at home with Monty while he is in recovery. Has anyone been through the ACL surgery? What do I need to expect? How did you manage to go through the whole process (and still work full time)?

UPDATE (Feb. 26, 2015): I've realized that I have not updated this discussion. So I just wanted to let you know that Monty had a TPLO surgery on January 29th. It was a partial tear on his ligament, his meniscus was fine. We are currelnty in week 4 post-op. He is doing great, it's hard to keep him calm since he thinks he can run and jump just fine. We did a second session of hydrotherapy today.

His next check-up is in 4 weeks.

Hydrotherapy - Feb. 26, 2015 

UPDATE (April 2, 2015):
We had our 8 week post-op checkup last Friday. The vet took x-rays of Monty's knee and everything seems to be healing fine. She did not see any limping. We were cleared to use the stairs a couple of times a day, so I finally got to sleep upstairs in my real bed. Monty still needs to be on leash at all times, but we are up to 30 minute walks a few times a day. We are still doing hydrotherapy once a week and several exercises daily. We are half way through the rehab period, yay!

Monty is actually having so much fun during his hydrotherapy:

Hydrotherapy #5 - March 25, 2015 

UPDATE, July 1, 2015:

We were in week 14 post-surgery, only two weeks away from Monty being able to run off leash. I noticed him limping on the other leg. The vet did tell us that there is more than 70% chance he would damage his other knee ligament thanks to over-compensating for such a long time. The partial tear was confirmed and Monty had a second knee surgery on June 24th. So here we go again, poor guy. We are down week 1 post surgery....15 more to go. I'm sure glad dogs only have two knees. The good news is that our pet insurance covers the second surgery as well. I just wish we didn't have to go through this yet again. What a sucky year for my boy.

UPDATE, November 1, 2015:

I'm yet again way too late with an update. The second knee surgery went fine, but Monty had tough few days afterwards. He had a different surgeon and this time they wrapped his entire leg after the surgery. Being a primadona, he refused to pee or poop...and after a couple of days refused to eat. So we rushed him in. As soon as the vet took off his leg wrap, we went outside and Monty finally relieved himself. After that, it was the usual recovery, including PT and hydrotherapy.

I'm happy to report that we finished all PT on Oct. 15th and slowly started off leash activities. First, a dog park without throwing a ball. Then short throws for him. It is really nice to be able to take both dogs out somewhere at the same time. 

Here is a fun video from Monty's last therapy session, he was wearing a GoPro camera:

Last rehab session from JarkaH on Vimeo.

I took both boys to an open space with creek today and Monty got the zoomies. Yikes! I still get covered in cold sweat when I see him run full speed or jump through ravines like he did today... I'll take me a while to stop worrying.

Video from today: 

Nov. 1, 2015 from JarkaH on Vimeo.

BUT: he had a blast AND I did not observe any weakness in his legs after he took a nap. It's sure soooo nice to see that he can play, take a nap, and not have a hard time getting up and walking. I'm really happy. Hopefully, we are off to a new start now. It's been a really long year... but it seems he is as good as new.

[Sally & Frank Shanley,and Megan]

Megan has surgery on both her CCL ligaments. She tore the first one three years ago chasing a ball and the second one was just a result of having had one fail. she's seven years old and recovered well from both of them. It is very important to keep them quiet which is the hardest thing on us. As you know doodles can adapt easily to new circumstances. We had crate trained Megan as a puppy and got a new cratefor each injury and she took to it right away. The hardest time is the first few weeks and after that it's just walking in getting there getting them built up again. There are various surgeries and even more opinions about what to do. Be sure that you trust your vet and explore the different surgeries. Megan is a medium Labradoodle and weighs about 35 pounds. We had the extracapsular surgery both times with great success. Good luck and I know your pup will be fine

[Cheryl and Finnegan]

I'm sorry to hear this Jarka.  I can't offer any advice on torn ACL but sure others can.  Hoping Sherri will comment.   Keeping you guys in our thoughts.

[Lucy & AnnaBelle's Mom]

Jarka -- So sorry that you are having to deal with this with Monty.  It is a lot of information to take in but I think the good news is that you can take a few days and absorb everything and decide what is best for you and Monty.  We did go through this with Lucy.  It was the same day that Lucy was finally allowed outside off leash that Sophie got sick so we went straight from one situation to dealing with the other.  There are several different types of procedures which I'm sure that they will explain to you.  Lucy had the Suture procedure.  This is where they drill a hole in the bone and do a figure 8 type pattern with what looks like fishing line.  This holds everything in place while scar tissue forms around all of it.  I think that the recovery time is a little longer with this procedure vs the others but the end result is the same.  The way they explained it to us is that with the larger dogs, it is really hard to get a partial tear to heal itself.  That if you have a little 25 lb dog that you can rest it for several weeks and sometimes get it to heal.  However with with the larger dogs it seems they tend to just keep re-tearing it.  The one bad part is they say that normally if one is torn then it will happen to the other leg usually within a year.  Fortunately we have not had this happen and I hope we never do.  I will say that the recovery time actually went better than I had anticipated.  However, we were both retired so didn't have to deal with the working part.  We had the ex-pen set up in a 4x4 square pattern and re set her crate back up.  During the day she was in the ex-pen in the living area and at night in her crate.  She stayed at the hospital at least one night.  She didn't put any weight on it for a few days after we got home, but was able to toe tap enough to at least get outside (hopefully you don't have steps).  We had two steps to get in and out of the house and she was able to handle those ok.  The first several days she just slept a lot.  She really didn't seem to mind her pen much at all.  If we were just sitting around watching tv I would get her out and sit on the floor with her.  We did have to keep the hard plastic type cone on her until the stitches came out because with the softer ones she could still get to the stitches.  She had probably a 3" incision right over the knee joint.  She was in the ex-pen or crate with the exception of potty breaks on leash for the first 6 weeks.  After that we were to start walking her 15 mins a couple times a day for the first week and then add 5 mins each week until we went back at 12 weeks.  At 12 weeks she was allowed off leash in the yard.  We were really nervous about letting her loose and running again.  She walked outside and laid down in the grass.  It was too funny.  I'm not sure how far you work from home, but I would think after the first few days you would be able to just come home for potty breaks.  Maybe like if you got it done on a Wed and he came home on Thurs or Fri you might possibly be able to go back by Mon or Tues.  I have some picks but don't have access to them at the moment to post them.  All in all I would say it went much better than we had ever hoped.  It took us a little longer to get her muscle tone in that leg built back up because we got sidetracked taking care of Sophie.  I think it takes probably 6 months of continued walking (and steps) to get that tone built back up.  I know that Nancy (Ned and Clancy) told me to walk curbs up and down to help build them back up.  I think it was her Springer that had the surgery.  If you think of any other questions just let me know.  I'm happy to share anything I can remember!

[Jarka, Monty & Auggie]

Wow, that all seems like a VERY long time to me. Thank you for all the info.

The vets at the rehab center did say exactly what you were stating about big dogs and healing, as well as about the possibility of torn ACL on the other leg. They also offered to work with Monty twice a week before and after the surgery to help with his muscle mass. I will know more on Friday after we see the specialist.

Unfortunately, I work 35 miles (one way) from home. Also, there are steps in the house. Our bedroom, where both boys are sleeping, is upstairs. And there are two steps to the backyard. Yikes!

[DJ & Chance]

Jarka, so sorry to hear this but glad the DK members are providing you with lots of helpful information.  You will make the best decision for Monty.

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

Jarka, Gordie has had two torn CCLs (in dogs they are CCL not ACL).  Gordie's were total tears and surgery was really the best option for us.  Our vet recommended a surgical facility in another town where specialists advised us on the most appropriate 'fix' for Gordie's situation.  Gordie was six when he tore his first CCL, and eight when he tore the second one. Gordie could bear NO weight on the leg either time, and there wasn't a waiting time to see if he might heal.

Lucy had a different repair procedure than Gordie's and the recovery timeline was different.

We kept Gordie in an ex-pen for a while, then tethered to the couch by us. We had a 'band' that we held that supported Gordie's back for his twice a day trip up stairs at bedtime and down again in the a.m.   We walked him on a leash for potty walking as directed.  I put a dog poo bag on the foot followed by a child's sock when we took him out.  Gordie was allergic to the pain patch medication and that was really dicey until we figured it out.

[Jarka, Monty & Auggie]

Oh poor baby. I didn't know this about Gordie.

Sadly, I think Monty got injured at a San Diego beach this last summer since that's when the lameness started.

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

So sorry for him!  Gordie was chasing Ned at a dog park and stepped in a gopher hole for the first one. I saw it happen.  For the second, it just 'happened.'  Suddenly he was lame.

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

Jarka, I'm so sorry to hear this news.  I have no experience with this, but it looks like you're getting lots of good advice. 

[GBK]

So sorry Jarka!  Unfortunately I will be watching this discussion closely as my vet suspects a partial tear in Buddy's left rear leg.  The next time the ortho specialist visits her practice I'm going to ask for him to look at it.  Don't know how he did it, but at our nosework trial he had a hard time putting weight on it coming out of his crate and then would walk it off and competed just fine.  He is no longer limping, but I do notice a difference in how much more he sits and lays down.  He's 9 and I really don't want to wait too long if surgery is needed.  Keep me posted and I will be thinking and praying for a great outcome for Monty.  You should see us getting into the backseat of the car now - I grab his butt and he pulls himself in with his front lets :)

[Jarka, Monty & Auggie]

Bummer! So sorry that sweet Buddy has to go through this as well. I'll keep you posted. Monty is getting around just fine and you would not be able to tell there is anything wrong, especially in the morning.

[Nicky, Riley & Boris]

I'm so sorry to hear this about Monty. All I can say is that this time last year Boris was post op for his operation on both shoulders and I do know what you are going through worry wise trying to make decisions. I didn't sleep a wink for the first few days trying to digest what the Vet specialist told us before we decided on surgery. I feel the same as Karen. We too had the choice to wait a little or do surgery. We opted for the surgery ASAP. Sheri's advice during the early weeks were very useful and it was easier than we thought it would be. What helped enormously in the rehab was the hydrotherapy. One thing we did was at night we lifted him onto the bed and because we were afraid he would decide to jump off placed him right in the middle of us. Well, a year later he's still there and neither of us have the heart to move him. :)
Ps I did buy a super huge crate as Boris was not happy alone so Riley went in with him and they were both happy together.