The f1 vs. f2?? What's your opinion?

[Sarah]

Hi, I'm new to this doodle blog, but am hoping I can get a little help.

I've always wanted a goldendoodle. I've been doing some research on them and realized I know nothing about this type of dog and I thought I did!!
I've found a breeder online who is close to where I live. This breeder has goldendoodle's for sale ranging from $1,200 for the f1 and $900 for the f2.
I believe the goldendoodle that the majority of people have is the f1, correct?
It's difficult to find any real information on the f2 variety. I know to get an f2 goldendoodle a breeder has to mate two f1's together.

Some websites say the f2 sheds less and is good for people who suffer from allergy's, but yet it's the cheaper of the doodles and not many breeders have them for sale.

Also other blog sites that I've come across, describes the f2 as a "disaster" and a breeder who has these dogs for sale is not is a "reputable" breeder. I've found the majority of goldendoodle breeders don't have the f2 as an option, so I'm wondering if the "reputable" breeder thing is correct? Is there something wrong with the f2? Why wouldn't I want to go with the f2?

Here's my wish: I'd love a goldendoodle that has that shaggy, can't see its eyes, floppy teddybear look. What generation should I get? What are the pro's and con's? What do you guys recommend, I'm completely lost and I have an appointment with the breeder by end of week.

Thank you very much!!
S.

[Amy and Annabelle]

I don't understand the theory behind an f2 because it is still 50% golden retriever and 50% poodle. I have an f1b and she is 75% poodle and 25% retriever. I got her because she was the least likely to shed which she doesn't and my relatives that have allergies are fine with her. She had a shave down in May for matting and now has a summer cut. Right now you can barely see her eyes, but I try to keep them trimmed up so she can see and so the hair doesn't scratch her eyes. I love the longer hair but only keep her like that in the winter. She was advertised as shaggy/wavy but her adult coat is more curly. It hasn't completely grown out from the shave down so I guess it will be a surprise to see if the longer adult coat is anything like her puppy coat. I am thinking not. It is a lot lighter in color now. She was more apricot when I brought her home and now she is more cream with some apricot ears and tail.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Hi Sarah, welcome to DK. 

The very first thing you should do if you are looking for a puppy is read our guidelines on What To Look for in a Breeder.

These are the minimum standards you should require; if anyone can't measure up, walk away.

I would be willing to bet that this breeder with the F2s would not meet these standards. 

For one thing, no reputable doodle breeder who does genetic health testing of the parents is selling puppies of any generation for $900. Even $1200 is very low. 

For another thing, it is true that reputable breeders are not breeding F2s, which is an F1 to F1 breeding. It is not recommended, because there is a fairly high likelihood that you will get puppies who in appearance are pure Golden Retriever. (Or pure Poodle, for that matter) F2s are the most unpredictable of all generations, and more likely to shed than any other generation including F1s, because you have shedding Retrievers one generation back on both sides. That's why most breeders don't have them for sale.

The generation least likely to shed would be an F1B, which is an F1 bred to a purebred Poodle. (There are some breeders who breed an F1 back to a Golden, but that's also not something that any reputable breeder does, as you might as well just get a Golden Retriever.) 

As far as what most people here have, I'd say that most people here, especially those with younger dogs, have F1Bs or multigens (F2B s and beyond).  There are a good number of us with F1s, too, but most of the reputable breeders have gone to multigenerational breeding nowadays. 
That shaggy floppy teddy bear look is often found in F1s, but it's never guaranteed. Your best bet is to go with a very experienced, reputable breeder who has repeatedly produced puppies with the look you like. Even then, there are no guarantees, but your odds are better. Expect to pay at least $1800. 
Hope this helps.

[Stephanie and Ragley]

My advice- go F1b or further down the generational line.

[Rhoni Ann]

My Cash is a F1,. I like you fell in love with that teddy bear look. But please don't be fooled, there is a lot of upkeep with this breed. Cash has more of a curly coat, mats really easily, has ear infections and sheds fluff-balls. Not so much sheds hair but there are a lot of black fluff-balls every time I sweep. There is not a groomer in my area that will take on a doodle, there for I have had to learn this own my own. He has to be brushed weekly, I'd advice lining up a couple of two hour movies and have more on stand by. So if you are up for all the grooming this breed requires, then you will find a constant shadow, companion and unconditional love. Good Luck!

[Lori, Winnie, Bob and Indie]

My Winnie is a F1 and very much a "shaggy teddybear." She looks a lot like several F1b's on this site- including Stephanie's Ragley. Personally, if I woudn't get a F2- for the reason that Karen stated. I'd go with a F1 that has some curls/waves as a young puppy, or a F1b.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

And besides curls/waves on the body, if you want that shaggy, hair in the eyes look, the pup must have clear signs of what are called "furnishings" on the face. An experienced, reputable breeder will know how to see that, even if you don't, lol. 

[Sue, Murphy and Bella ()*o*()]

Sarah, besides the f1-f2 debate, it is important to know that these are not "bargain" dogs. $900.00 is a bargain and there is likely a reason. Just be an educated consumer in regards to the quality of breeder when choosing.

[Lucy & AnnaBelle's Mom]

Lots of good advice here.  I have two F1's but have owned 3 doodles and fostered about 5 others.  A couple things I can tell you is that most likely (I never say always) if you have a shaggy vs. curly doodle you are going to have some shedding.  Could be even as bad as a Golden.  However, that being said, because they shed you are less like to have the matting issues that you can get with the ones that don't shed.  Our AnnaBelle is a very shaggy F1 and sheds some but you can comb her out with a comb.  Our Lucy sheds very little to none and she takes much longer to groom as her coat is much thicker and tends to get some mats even being brushed daily.   I also highly recommend going with a reputable breeder.  My first purchase was two liter mates and I was not nearly as informed as I should be (pre-DK).  I purchased liter mate Sisters.  One we lost to Lymphoma at 5 years and the other has had a CCL surgery, has both food and environmental allergies so her monthly allergy meds are about $175 and she just recently had 5 growths removed.  She is my million dollar dog.  My AnnaBelle came from the best of the best and she has been to the Vet only for her annual check up and shots.  I'm not going to say that you can't have problems if you go with the best, stuff happens.  I'm just going to say it is much less likely, in my opinion.  Regardless, get Pet Insurance immediately.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I would agree that Annabelle's breeder is "the best of the best". She is honest and ethical, and her breedings are very consistent in terms of the puppies' coats & appearance, which is so important if a certain kind of look is a high priority. 

[Joanne ~ Spud*]

Agreed. If, I were to ever get another...... I know where to go

[Sue, Murphy and Bella ()*o*()]

I was just talking to her and she is now doing mini and med multigens. Said she is up to F4's. Had to ask what makes an F4 and am waiting to hear back. 

[Lynda Kamrath]

Yes, that is interesting to many of us.  I have a 6th generation ALD and not sure what that means, but he is a great dog, does not shed and even does not mat.  Easy care coat.  I felt that the F1b was the best way to go because my F1b also had a wonderful coat.  Since the F2s have been rather unpredictable, I think I would stay away from that if it matters at all.  If your pup is neutered or spayed, it really doesn't matter as long as you like the way the dog looks and love the dog.