Taurine results are back, please take this seriously

[Melissa]

I know this was mentioned and basically discarded, so I'm posting this here.  We tested all of our dogs, and all three are low.  Our golden doodle is 118 (whole blood), which is critically low.  I have always fed the foods recommend on this site.  

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Cassava is a root and it's what tapioca comes from. It's toxic raw, as it contains an acid that causes cyanide poisoning. But when it's properly processed, it's safe, obviously, as lots of baby foods contain tapioca, lol. 

Cassava is very high in vitamin C, which doesn't matter in dogs because unlike us, dogs make their own vitamin C and don;t need to get it from their food. It's  also moderately high in potassium and magnesium, and very high in fiber. I know of no risks to dogs or anyone else from it, and while it hasn't been used much in dog foods, I've seen tapioca in dog treats and never heard of any problems.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Sorghum's a grain that's been around forever, and it's been especially popular in the South, where it's made into syrup. It's more recently gained more widespread popularity elsewhere because it's gluten free and can be used as a substitute for wheat. I know of no issues with sorghum, either. 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I would say this; I'd take a chance on a new line that doesn't contain ingredients that are known to be harmful before I would feed my dog a formula that contains menadione, which very few foods these days do. I know you don't need more to worry about, but the risks of menadione are just too high for you to not be aware of them:
https://truthaboutpetfood.com/a-pet-food-ingredient-to-be-wary-of-m...
http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9924604

http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=menadione

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Annamaet has only one formula with grains and a protein level high enough to meet your requirements, Ultra Sport, but it looks to be a good one. No peas, legumes, or potatoes, 32% protein, and it has a much better Omega 6:3 ratio than the Dog Sport formula. 

I'd say this might be your best option, Melissa.
http://www.annamaet.com/products/Ultra_Formula

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Funny, I went to look at the Annamaet line and they have a very interesting article on their website about the TD DCM controversy. I was especially gratified to read this part: 

"Although many think this is something new, similar problems arose in the mid-2000’s with rice bran and lamb based diets. The exact same scenario was identified in Newfoundlands as well as a few other atypical DCM breeds on these diets, who were eating lower protein, non-methionine/taurine supplemented, high insoluble and soluble fiber, and high ash diets. This sounds similar to the problem today: low protein, non-supplemented methionine/taurine, high insoluble and soluble fiber, high ash diets. This time they are grain free, which may be due to their current popularity in the marketplace.

"This is a very frustrating concern with no definitive solution other than ensuring quality protein is being used and that we are supplementing with additional methionine and/or taurine in diets. Annamaet has been doing this in all of our formulas for many years – grain free or not. Those of us formulating diets remember the same crisis developing in 2003 from rice bran and lamb meal, therefore when we formulate, we are always sure to include methionine and/or taurine. Sadly, even in that situation from 2003, when investigators tried to recreate the disease they were unsuccessful. This showed us that it has a lot more to do with the dog, the microbiota in the GI, and the processing of dog food than it has to do with the ingredient base. Let’s not start a “knee jerk reaction” about any specific ingredients, but perhaps examine the pet food industry, the company making the food, their science and who they have on board as formulators and nutritionists."

http://www.annamaet.com/news/Grain_Free_Diets_&_Cardiomyopathy

Good advice.

[Stella]

Love this!!!!

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I know, right? 

[Andrea, Belle and Honey]

Thanks for all this info Karen.  I have been looking for a new food for Belle because some months ago for some unknown reason she developed an aversion to the Orijen that she had been happily eating since she finished with puppy food. (She still enthusiastically tries to eat dead birds, slugs and toxic wisteria root, but turns up her nose at expensive Orijen??!!??) Anyway, I am curious to know what you think about kibble that provides proteins only from chicken and fish meals, and that contains beet pulp? 

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

Andrea, none of these foods are formulas that I would choose for a normal healthy dog. And certainly not for a dog who has been on Orijen. These are being looked at because of all this stuff with the Taurine Deficient Dilated cardiomyopathy andf the limitations that are being put on the ingredients in affected dogs' diets. We are trying to find anything better than the Purina garbage the vet has recommended to Melissa that will meet those standards. If you don't have a really good reason for going down that same path, I'd stick with a grain free formula more similar to Orijen. If you want to start a new discussion, I can help. 
Foods that contain beet pulp are generally not high quality foods. But we are not talking high quality foods here with this issue. 

[Melissa]

I will take a look at all of these.  Are there concerns with taking a food with something like the 25% or 26% protein and adding toppers on a regular basis?  Is there a way to calculate the protein?  I need to add food based taurine at this point anyway, so there will be supplementation involved.  I'm also wondering how my dog will feel when he only gets 1 1/2 cups of food a day because of the calorie per cup. :)

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

I think your vet is wanting higher protein. Maybe ask if 25% would be acceptable if you added cooked chicken. 

There are online nutrition calculatoras that will give you the protein content for a specific food, like 4 oz of cooked white meat chicken, for example. But that's going to be in grams, and I have no idea how you would know how many grams of protein these vets are recommending for these dogs who are affected. 30% of the food being protein really means nothing in terms of how many grams there are. 

I think you need to ask the vet about this. 

[Susan Hernandez]

Karen, What do think of the product line manufactured by Nature's Logic? It  contains no legumes or potatoes.