OMD - They are fighting!

[Jane, Rooney & Stuart]

Up till this point Rooney has pretty much held on the alpha role with Stuart.  Rooney being almost 13 months to Stuarts almost 6 months - Rooney thought that since this was his turf he would lay the law down to Stuart.  Stuart being a puppy, was a little bitey to Rooney but he quickly taught him a thing or two.  There was a lot of wrestling and play biting, growling, etc.  I got back from NYC today - haven't seen the boys in 5 days and things HAVE CHANGED.  Stuart is asserting himself and is really being a bully.  Rooney tries to stand up for himself but Stuart does have him on size now (21.5 to 39 lbs).  Rooney has gotten very vocal, and they are really fighting now - biting each other too hard.  I've broken it up several times and told them "no".  I've put Stuart down for a nap - to give Rooney some space.  Once (and it was a BIG mistake) Rooney was running from Stuart and I picked Rooney up, now when things get rough he runs to me - I haven't picked him up again.  Is this normal?  How much do I let them figure out themselves?  When is rough too rough?  Am I right to intervene?  Help!

[Maryann,Roo and Tigger]

Funny you should write this.  Well, not so funny really, but certainly coincidental.

 

Roo is very nearly four and Tigger is three plus.  They have always gotten along very well.  Difficult to say after both became adults (same size) who was alpha.

I have had my sons three huskies for about  a month.  No problems other than a lot of poop and dog hair.  They left last Friday to return home to my son's new house ( and new fence - hence the extended dog visit).

 

I have been busy congratulating myself on my own and my son's superior dog raising ability hah.  Pride goeth before a fall- or something like that.  Boom - Saturday morning - first feeding without the other three dogs:  Roo and Tigger eat breakfast.  Roo finishes first as usual and lays down by his bowl, eyes averted from Tigger.  Tigger just barely finishes and somehow the joint signal that goes between them that it is okay to check out each other's bowl goes astray.  Tigger jumps on Roo snarling, lips pulled all the way back and really going after him.  Roo first tries to just move away and then turns belly up.  Tigger is having none of it and  continues the attack.  They have to be physically separated.  I am just absolutely flabergasted.  This has never happened to me before with any of my dogs.  I tell them sternly "down", then "Roo go place".  Roo slinks away in shame and horror.  Tigger is still hot under the collar and must be physically taken to "place" by me, being chastised the whole way.  Tigger is made to stay "down" on place a long time ( probably 30 minutes).  Tigger is glad to be released, but does not look in anyway ashamed.  Roo on the other hand is in dog tears and can barely be convince it is okay to leave his place.  Roo apologizes to me profusely.  Tigger and Roo go about their day as if nothing happened.  A simple missed communication, completely forgotten and forgiven.

 

This is, of course my interpretation of their actions.  The long weekend continues with no other problems.  They both slurp leftovers from the same ice cream dish, best buds again.  What the #*&%#@!

 

Generally, I am of the mindset, let them sort it out.  But this was too intense for me.  For me it was too intense because of no warning, the fully exposed teeth, fierce growling, and not nipping but intending to hang on - I know it takes two to fight, but Tigger was way out of line.  Back to the leash work for Tigger - I guess he is having a delayed adolesence.  yuck

 

 

 

 

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

I think this is a perfect interpretation....and at that point I would have intervened too.  I love how they can totally get "pis....ed" at each other and be best friends ten minutes later....they forget that it ever even happened.

[Jennifer and Jack]

Hey Jane....... I feel for you.. I really do... Jack and Molly are living as siblings right now and Molly is for sure trying to dominate Jack.. which sort of makes sense because he is sick so maybe she see's him as the weaker one???? I don't know.

 

I was told the same thing as you, to let them work it out unless a real fight broke out where someone was going to get hurt. I am having a hard time with that.. and while Molly will be leaving in a couple of weeks.. we have to deal with it now..

 

I don't like bullying of any kind either and while I don't agree with letting them work it out really, I don't know what other choice there is..... I can't stand to  see Molly rip toys out of Jack's mouth, Jack does try to defend himself but he will cater to her.. she will not back down....unless Jack really growls nasty... his warning growls mean nothing to her, and as soon as he gives the serious growl she backs down for all of one second.. she will take his toys and lay on top of them and Jack looks at me so confused... and I want to intervene.... especially with Jack not feeling well.

 

This is one of the biggest reasons I feared getting two dogs, I don't want any one to be bullied... and I personally even though Molly is not mine, feel very torn between giving them each love and attention and making sure both of their needs are being met.... If I go to hold Molly Jack will wrestle with her to distract her from me and vice versa..

 

They only want what the other one has.. bones, food, toys etc, once they get it, they no longer want it.

 

You are not alone..

 

Sending love to you all

 

 

[Jane, Rooney & Stuart]

Yes we have the jealousy thing too.  If I am getting loves or giving attention to one - the other one will push their way into the action.  I'm hoping this is just a stage but I am going to put some "rules" in place.  I am not going to step in unless there is a yelp and then it will be a "time out".  I am also going to make a bigger effort to give each boy some time with momma alone. My boys do not get fed together, Stuart is behind the gate in the hallway and Stuart eats just on the other side.  Rooney is a slow, picky eater and Stuart would eat boogers and woof it right down so there is no way I'd chance feeding them together, Rooney would starve to death, lol.

I've been away Jennifer so I am not up to speed on DK yet but I'm hoping that you get some answers for Jack's problems soon!

[Jane, Guinness and Murphy]

I thought more about this last night.  Some of it may be that their routine has been turned upside-down with you away for a few days.  When we were at the Beach this Summer and Murph started with all those bad behaviors, much of that was due to the drastic change in his life.  His bullying did get worse as he got more and more "full of himself".  Once we got back to normal and I could correct him when he was going too far with the terrorizing of poor Guinness, he got the message and things have been so much better.  Here's hoping that's part of what's going on with your guys too.  Good luck.

[Mimi Linna, Lilly and Lolly]

ha ha ha...eat boogers.

[Amy, Cubbie & Ollie]

Jane, I went through this two months ago when we adopted Ollie.  There was an actual fight and Cubbie got his but kicked and it cost me the $85 trip to the emergency vet.  After that I spoke with my trainer and he suggested that I take away all of their toys for a few days and keep both of them off of the furniture.  It was difficult and I felt bad taking all of those things away from Cubbie since he was used to living the good life, but I have to admit that it really helped.  We kept them off the couch for about a week (which took a lot of effort!) and kept all toys away for a week and a half.  After that time, we gave them back some chewing bones and then gradually were able to add back the rest of the toys.  The point with taking everything away is that 1) they won't have anything to fight over and 2) they will learn to play with each other if they didn't want to be bored.  It might be harder for you since Stuart is still in the puppy chewing stage though.

 

If I am giving Cubbie attention and Ollie tries to butt in (which he always does), I push him away and tell him "Cubbie's turn".  When I am petting Ollie, I will ignore Cubbie and say "Ollie's turn".  Ollie is gradually getting better with this.  Then a lot of the time, I just play around with them both at the same time.

 

Since both of my dogs are close in age I decided that I was going to just treat them pretty much equal.  People will probably disagree with that, but I figure that I am the alpha and that they both are below me (and my husband).  I give Cubbie his food first though since he eats sooooo much slower than Ollie, but that isn't about making him alpha that is more about just giving him a head start!  lol

 

Oh, one other tip...we purchased a small airhorn that we keep on hand just in case they should start trying to kill each other again.  They have been doing really well the last few weeks so we haven't had to use it.  After trying to break up one dog fight I had to find a safer way and my trainer suggest that we use the airhorn to just get their attention away from each other and stop the fight long enough to separate them.

 

Good luck with everything and be sure to keep us posted!!

[Joanna, Zoe & Bender]

Hmmmm~ i know this discussion is old but I currently have two that are pretty close in age so I was wondering how everyone is doing?  

ALso, Amy is it bad that I put down Ben's food before Zoe's?  Zoe likes to eat on the living room rug corner so I usually pick up both bowls, set Bens down in front of him (because he is still in the kitchen) and then walk over to the living room rug corner and set down her bowl.  

I really can't tell if one is more alpha than the other except that Ben is bigger and stronger when they play fight and he's pretty selfish with toys.  But Zoe is always the one that tries to switch treats with him and goes after his.  

[Amy, Cubbie & Ollie]

Joanna, I would just do whatever works best for you as far as the food in concerned.  

When it comes to the toys, just keep an eye on them.  If they don't seem to be having any major problems (i.e. fighting) then they are probably both ok with how things are.  If the situation ever starts to escalate into something more, then you might want to limit the amount of toys that they have available to them.  There is nothing wrong with Ben not wanting to share his toys or have Zoe take them away from him.  Would you always want someone to take things away from you?  If it becomes a problem, then work on correcting Zoe when she steals things from Ben.

[Joanna, Zoe & Bender]

Hi Amy,

I just saw your comment right now! Zoe and Ben do not fight but i just wrote a discussion on how Zoe no longer wants to play with him.  I hope it's just a phase and they are best friends again soon =(

[Mimi Linna, Lilly and Lolly]

thank you for posting this and thank you all that replied. We are getting a goldendoodle from the breeder that is one month younger than Lilly and wondering what to do if/when they start fighting.