Food --- Grain free or Grains????

[NS]

Hi again!! I am still in search of the perfect food for Bodi. As you know, Giardia 4x, bacterial imbalance 1x -- Panacur + Metro multiple times. A month ago his stools was formed, soft but had mucous. I took it to the vet. They said there was no parasite but that the mucous indicated bad flora in his gut. They suggested a probiotic, Proviable DC or Tylan. Bodi had been taking Proviable + Gentle Digest for 4 months so we opted for the Tylan. He took the Tylan 2x a day for 7 days -- he didn't have any marked improvement. The vet thinks his stool is soft because the food might be too rich for him. He was on TOTW, FROMM, Honest kitchen, Orijen and now she wants me to try a limited ingredient food. I came home with California Natural because I wonder if perhaps he needs grain in his diet and that might be the missing link. The foods I have fed him to date have been grain free. What do you think? I was torn between purchasing InstinctLimited Ingredients but ended up with California Natural because it is a limited ingredient with some grains...

All thoughts and suggestions are welcome and appreciated.

Thanks in advance!

[NS]

Thanks. Agreed on all fronts. Bodi has been on the limited ingredient Acana duck &Pear for about 6 weeks, we give him a little pumpkin and/or sweet potato too. His vet wanted us to keep him on the Tylan for 6 weeks -- we are about 4 weeks into it. Again, his stools are formed but not firm. We are not adding anything new to his diet. We will see how it goes. He is doing OK but I wonder if he still has a strain of the Giardia. I might have the vet do the test again just to make sure....

[Fitz & Henry]

Make the vet send it out and not do just a quick snap test though... There are false negatives all the time.

[Fitz & Henry]

I haven't changed anything... He is still on TOTW food which he came with from ML in June. I have made zero changes, I've just focused on getting him better. I have given him probiotics & yogurt to help the gut, but this is not his gut, it's the Giardia. It's always the damn Giardia. I've added pumpkin to his food, it barely helps. The only product that has helped the stool is From Honest Kitchen and it's called Perfect Form. But it's a band aid, we need to rid him from the Giardia.
My vet has never seen anything like this before, we dont have crazy virulent strains of Giardia in the Midwest - she wants to send him to a specialist & a parasitologist. That's gonna be nice and $$$.
I'm just irritated that they act like my case is not like anything they've ever dealt with before, When I get on this site it seems like what we are dealing with is the norm.

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

So you are still getting positive fecals for giardia? 

[Julie and Charlie]

I think a good parasitologist would be someone that I would want to talk to if my dog had a resistant strain of Giardia- it might be worth the up front "investment" to avoid a life of GI problems, many rounds of Metronidazole, and continually trying to clean the house, the yard, and the dog.

[Fitz & Henry]

This is a good point... Maybe a parasitologist is a good idea. However the Breeder is the one who should be looking into that though in my opinion.... Why haven't they???

[Julie and Charlie]

Well, it's your dog now.... and you need to figure out how to treat him appropriately. I wouldn't let my breeder make that decision.

I would say that people who buy from her and have experiences with resistant Giardia should be reporting them on public forums with the name of the breeder. (I noticed she has close to 40 females on her site... are they really all actively breeding?)

[Fitz & Henry]

The Honest Kitchen product Perfect Form, is all natural ingredients such as pectin, papaya leaf, pumpkin & slippery elm... I think it's an AMAZING product.... And it does work.
The can is $12.00 & it lasts a long time. You just add it to their food.

[Fitz & Henry]

Yes still positive fecal reports.

[Fitz & Henry]

I didn't mean that I won't see a parasitologist. Yes this dog is my responsibility and i am fighting like crazy to get him healthy. I just meant if I were a breeder with constant issues of resistant drug Giardia coming from my location, then I would be working my arse off trying to figure out how to deliver HEALTHY dogs to my customers for the hefty sum of $2,500.+ $350 for shipping.
I think it's illegal to ship animals that are sick, they need to be cleared by a Vet and supposedly these animals when they arrive have been seen by a vet. The Vet obviously works for them, and I think could get in a lot of trouble. They shouldn't be cleared to travel.
I know there are all these new laws and changes coming regarding selling puppies on the Internet.

As far as how many dogs they have breeding there.... Lots! It looks like 3-4 litters per month.

[Julie and Charlie]

Yeah, that's what a good breeder would do. It would be interesting to hear her take on the problem and what she's doing to combat it. If the answer is "nothing" then, well, you have your answer.

[Fitz & Henry]

My guess is they aren't doing a whole lot. Many of my conversations with them have sounded very scripted in their response. Kim actually replied back to me when her assistant was out sick. And she herself told me, that some vets will just let the Giardia and I quote here, "run it's course" . And she thinks I I should be focusing on firming up his stool with pumpkin.
Okay.... There is NO vet who would say that because Giardia doesn't run a "course" that ends.
She also suggested that my dog may be an asyptomatic carrier.

I told her he HAS symptoms so that's not the case. And pumpkin is a band aid not a solution.... I just want him better, that's it. I am hoping to find people who actually have kicked the ML Gardia strain.... And I'd love to know how?!?!?