Just started raw today

[Kimberly and Mikey]

We just started raw today for my doodle. We have had a long road battling allergies and food sensitivities so this is what was recommended. I bought the pre made chubbs of vital essentials in turkey. I am new to this and have no clue about raw. I was feeding his kibble twice a day. Do I feed him raw once or twice a day?

Any tips would be appreciated. 

Thanks

[Shari Becker]

Trudy is right about the chewing. It's important to give your dogs other things to gnaw on if they are eating raw. I like to give Lexi the Stella and Chewy's patties, still slightly frozen. I've also added some Real Meat food when we travel and when we're out of raw, and that is like little jerky pieces she has to really work at. Raw marrow bones and the chicken necks and wings (which were recommended by my raw vet just for tooth workout). So if you go with the chubs, you do need to find other chomping options. We always have a Yak Chew around, and I also do a lot of cod skin chews. You can order those from honest kitchen, and they are work to break down.

[Kimberly and Mikey]

oh my! This is so overwhelming. Should I serve the portions a little more frozen? He can't have any chicken due to allergies. All these things go in the food bowl at the same time? Do you feed once daily. See the store said thaw and feed and I was like ok no biggie. Now I'm stressed out. I don't even know when to find all these items. I got the pre made because with our 2 small kids, work and school I don't have time for anything else. Should I freeze the chubb portions or go back to kibble

[Shari Becker]

Don't panic! I have two kids and I work, and this is why I buy the prepackaged raw, too. It's not as hard as it seems. I buy the patties because they are even easier. Here is my current system. (The expensive, I don't make my own system)

I always have a package of frozen raw. I take out about 2 days worth at a time. I feed the first two servings a little cold, but the second day it is fully defrosted. I always have a pack of the freeze dried patties in the cupboard in case I run out. Just this summer we added this food to our mix (sorry raw purists) because she had been eating their treats for years with no issues: http://www.amazon.com/Real-Meat-Dried-Beef-Treat/dp/B00629UGG6. We buy a 10 lb bag because it is most affordable long term, and we use it now pretty regularly. Sometimes raw just feels hard when life is too crazy with kids, etc...  The trick is to find the system that keeps your dog happy and you not too insane. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. Our vet says our dog looks amazing. She has healthy fur, clear eyes, very clean teeth (even on the mushy raw).

[Shari Becker]

I keep my kids far away when I feed her. And I tell them not to go near her if she's chewing on a bone. She's snapped at my kids three times in her whole life and twice was when she had a bone, and they came close... 

And I am probably going to try adding in some actual meat with bones. My girls are both over ten now, and life is settling down. But I live in a neighborhood where the grocery stores are so pricey, it's hard for me to imagine I'll save money. But I'll give it a whirl.

[Trudy Harlow]

As I keep saying, dealing with raw meat from the grocery is just as easy and far less expensive. Kimberly: go to the grocery and wander down the meat counter. Buy a chunk of beef on sale. Or maybe bison. Maybe some beef ribs. Not ox tail, too bony.

Is your husband a hunter? Does he know any? Venison is really good and usually comes frozen (but the bones there are dense as well).

Don't panic! This is like shopping for your family. No more, no less. Way easy. Don't make it harder than it needs to be.

[Shari Becker]

Trudy, Lexi is 40lbs ish.

Kimberly, I am sorry I've hijacked your conversation.

I hope that all of this is helpful. No more questions on your board, I promise!

It sounds like it might be easiest for you to just start with the packaged meat and get your dog's health stabilized. Don't feel guilty. The most important thing is that your dog is healthy and your are not feeling overwhelmed and crazy.

Prepackaged raw is still better than kibble.

Chubs are cheapest, but you might also want to do a price breakdown based on how much he is eating. Primal is actually much more expensive than Stella and Chewy's. Stella and Chewy's needs a smaller portion than Steve's, e.g., to fulfill your dog's daily needs.... So even thought he bulk Steve's seems like a great deal, you fly through it. 

[Trudy Harlow]

The problem with chicken necks and wings is they have small pieces of bones that some dogs will swallow whole and may choke on. Additionally, it's far too much bone for any one day. I just wouldn't do it.

Regarding marrow bones, again, they are weight bearing bones from cattle, and far too dense for a dog's teeth. All beef bones, with the possible exception of soft ribs, should not be given to dogs, unless you want to risk a broken tooth.

Large chunks of meat with a little bone in them is so easy and so much better -- and probably much cheaper -- than chubs.

[Shari Becker]

Okay, Trudy, I don't want to sound like an idiot, but I feel like I've been totally following the advice of the raw pet food seller in my neighborhood. They sell whole boxes of necks and wings and packages of raw marrow bones. Can you give me an example of a beef cut with meat that has a few bones? I don't think pork is an option for us, it isn't a food we bring into our home normally. But I can happily try her on chicken again ... and, of course, beef. Do you buy raw fish? I was under the impression that raw fish is really tricky, lots of parasite and worm potential.

[Shari Becker]

This is what happens when you feed raw in the middle of an urban, east coast city. No hunters, just over priced pet stores and grocery stores, like Whole Foods.

[Trudy Harlow]

I live in the DC area, so I know your problem. :o)  Still, there are hunters out in the 'burbs, and you can find them if you try. Lots of them are happy to get rid of frost-bitten meat from their freezers. Put an ad on Craigs List or Freecycle...

Beef ribs, especially the soft ones on the end of the rack, are okay.

Your raw pet food seller of course wants you to buy what they have. But that doesn't mean it's good for your dog. Right?

How big is your dog? Paddy, at 50 lbs, is happy with a chicken breast. But he is a delicate eater, not a chow hound, so another dog may find that just an appetizer. A half chicken would be perfect.

Yes, freeze fish and then thaw. As opposed to canned.

[Trudy Harlow]

We feed the Raw Meaty Bones diet -- kind of a misnomer because it's really not much bone. We buy regular meat on sale at the supermarket (or Costco or BJ's) and feed him that: beef shanks (minus the bone because it's too dense and might break his teeth, but definitely the marrow), chicken, pork. I always freeze the meat for about 2 weeks first before feeding. I do not give him any veggies (don't believe dogs need them because their digestive tracts are 99.9% identical to wolves'). He gets liver and heart, plus raw eggs and salmon oil. That's about it. SO easy! If you want to know more, join the Raw Meaty Bones group on Yahoo and lurk there awhile, read their files, etc. Also, you can get Dr. Tom Lonsdale's Book, "Raw Meaty Bones," and read it.

We started feeding raw a number of years ago for the same reasons. Raw feeding has almost completely cleared up all the itchiness. The only thing he still deals with is seasonal allergies -- just like I do. You are welcome to go to my blog and read about our journey, and I'm happy to answer any questions you might have.

[Shari Becker]

Trudy, Lexi sneezes all spring, too! Also like me! 

It's interesting that you don't do any fruits or vegetables, I talked to one raw food seller who said that there is some belief that dogs get important nutrients through grass and herbs. That they aren't always eating meat. That biologically, they probably had to nibble between "kills." 

Anyhow, we do add some pumpkin or sweet potatoes occasionally, to keep her regular. 

I actually give Lexi 'clean' food scraps all the time: eggs, apples, cooked carrots green beans and cooked broccoli. She gets leftover pure meat that we've eaten, too. We also let her snack on goat yogurt. Of course, I have a dog who is perpetually wanting to eat, so I feel like these are healthy, low cal ways to keep her satiated. My vet said the green beans are a great way to make her feel fuller. (Her weight is perfect, so she is not really hungry.)

I have also heard you need to freeze your meat for at least 2 weeks before serving it to kill all the bacteria. I've given her frozen chicken wings and necks. (She doesn't seem to react to the occasional chicken treat) The Stella and Chewy's price tag is kind of killing me though, so maybe I should be braver about it and just start getting her meat at the store, too. Do you worry about where the meat is sourced from?

And do you buy ground or regular hunks of meat?