DNA TEST F1B maybe not an F1B?

[Annie]

HI~

I am considering getting a DNA test for my goldendoodle and was wondering if anyone had any experience with them.  I am skeptical that the breeder was honest with me about Fiona's parents.  She is supposedly an F1B but has no facial furnishings like both her parents and the 75% poodle really isn't there.  She sheds a lot also.  We paid a lot of money for her and I want to be sure we got what we paid for.  She's a sweet girl and no matter what she is ours, but I want to know for sure and hold the breeder accountable.  I am disappointed with her response to me and can now see it's a business transaction for her and that is it.  She does not care about her dogs one bit.  Thank you for any input!!

[Karen, Jasper and Jackdoodle]

This has also puzzled me for years. 

[Adina P]

There's gotta be another gene we don't know about then.  Maybe some kind of gene that blocks furnishings?  Because some F1s have such minimal furnishings it is almost hard to believe they had a poodle parent.

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

I find genetics fascinating and think we still have a long way to having a full understanding.

[Stella]

I can attest to DNA tests being unreliable. My friend has a dog that she brought back with her as a puppy after working in a community in northern Canada. All the dogs up there are wolf/ husky/ sometimes shepherd mixes. For fun she sent away a DNA sample for testing, he had very short legs so we were joking he had some corgi in him! The test came back saying he is a poodle GSD cross - if you see this dog, there is no way that is correct! And I'm pretty sure there has never been a poodle in that community - it is a fly in community north of the arctic circle!! Her dog is black and white with the thick husky coat, it turns out he has dwarfism due to malnutrition as a foetus, this is why his legs are stunted!

[Nancy & Echo]

As others have pointed out, genetics can be complex.

I know next to nothing about doodle genetics in particular, but in general there can be many steps between a certain DNA code and the final protein product.  Some of the processes we know about are that sometimes other genes can control the expression of other genes.  Sometimes proteins can be trimmed, or other things such as sugars, be added to make a glycoprotein. Expression can be affected by environmental factors or age.

For example, it is quite unusual for every human with a certain deleterious mutation (genotype)  to have a disease (phenotype). 

I was also surprised in dogs to find out that one litter can contain pups from different fathers.

[Maryann,Roo and Tigger]

Aa Nancy and Echo pointed out genes are much more complicated than initially thought.  My genetics is rusty and has some age on it, but I do know that very few if any genes act alone or are "always dominant or always recessive".  I think getting a DNA test for your F1B would not be very useful to you in the long run.  You have clearly bonded to her and any legal process would be excessively expensive and probably of not useful outcome.

Becoming recognized by the AKC as a "breed" is hundreds of generations of dogs with certain reliable characteristics and even then a throwback occurs occasionally.  An F1B goldendoodle is no guarantee of anything except a dog with mixed  poodle and golden retriever characteristics with an emphasis on "mixed"!  To me that is a large part of their charm.  I have ALD brothers that have more consistent characteristics than F1B, simply owing to a slightly longer ALD to ALD breeding.  Roo and Tigger are still very dissimilar. Roo sheds some, which is increasing with age and health issues.  Tigger sheds not a hair and is (knock on wood) free of any serious health issues.  Roo has had Addison's disease since 18 months and now has congestive heart failure.  Roo has a more poodle looking body type whereas Tigger is a very good body type as desired by the the ALD standard.  Roo is super cuddly and friendly, Tigger has a more poodle type disposition, friendly, but aloof.  I could go on and aon.  

As you puppy ages, if you have good tempermant and good health consider yourself very blessed.  Before long you won't even care about "furnishings", because her heart and yours will be so intertwined. 

[Amy and Annabelle]

Unless you have a rescue and don't know anything about him, I think any DNA testing should just be for fun and nothing else. Doodles are a mixed breed and you pretty much get what you get. I have an f1b, she looks and acts100% poodle. I know there is 25% GR in there somewhere, but where, I don't know. It sure isn't physical or temperament.

[Debra Baker]

I have two labradoodle,  one is Lilly,  her mom was a labradoodle bred back to a poodle.  She has all the facial furnishings. My second dog is Ruger, he turned out with open face, very curly on his back ears etc but not on snout or legs. His mom was an australian labradoodle and dad was same as Lilly.  If I would breed him to a female 100% poodle, what do you think I would get for pups?  I did a dna on Ruger, results came back that he was poodle/lab/cocker spaniel mix.

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

Lab-poodle-cocker are Australian Labradoodle DNA. I don't think reputable breeders would breed a non-doodle looking dog whether back to a poodle or to another doodle. Fictionally guessing, you would get whatever you might get from a first crossing. BTW, Ruger is one handsome dog whether he looks like a conventional doodle or not.

[Debra Baker]

Yes he is handsome and personality plus!!

[Jolene, Sassparilla & Josie]

I posted on another conversation regarding DNA testing please take a look or under my name.  I had my Josie DNA tested a few years back and was very pleased with the results. She came back Miniature Poodle, Labrador Retriever and of all things Greyhound which I see a lot of in her.

[Debbie and Toby]

Fiona is adorable!