Sit and Stay the Cesar Way

[Krista, Angel, and Toby]

Hi all. I was wondering if anyone has bought any of Cesar Millan's DVDs (not the Dog Whisperer seasons). I am particularly interested in Sit and Stay the Cesar Way. It looks interesting, but I haven't heard anything about it on here or elsewhere really. Is it worth it? Are any of his other videos good buys or necessities? If so, why? Thanks!!

[Lynne B]

I hope I don't start a war here but I can't stand Cesar Milan, he makes dogs obey by either wearing them out on treadmills until they can't resist, or jerking their leash, kicking them or punching them in the neck (and yes, all those things are on video- you just have to watch close to see what he is doing). That makes dogs listen out of fear.

I prefer to use positive reinforcement. If you get animal planet on TV you might watch Victoria Stillwell's show "it's me or the dog", or you can google some really good trainers and behaviorists who use positive reinforcement; like Jean Donaldson, Ian Dunbar or Patricia McConnell. Here is a really good website If you search around there, you will find two free e-books by Ian Dunbar "before you get your puppy" and "after you get your puppy"

[LuvMyAbby&Kaela]

I love Cesar too. And he does not kick and punch the dogs. He emulates a bite by basically giving a sharp prod...to get their attention. And it is true that dogs are better dogs when they get lots of exercise. With our early dogs my husband naturally used Cesars way before Cesar was known. He automatically played the authority figure over the dogs (pack leader) and didnt tolerate bad behavior. The dogs respected him, obeyed him and listened to him. I on the otherhand was "Little Miss Always Nice and Never Stern becaue It is Mean" but the dogs didnt listen to me well, didnt obey me, and basically played Merry Heck with me until I adopted the stern authoritarian role too. (but still hugged them and kissed them - lol)

[Lynne B]

I know he has devoted followers, but I am not alone in disagreeing with his techniques.

http://www.urbandawgs.com/divided_profession.html

http://www.4pawsu.com/cesarfans.htm

http://askdryin.com/blog/2009/03/09/new-study-finds-popular-%E2%80%...

The difference between Cesar Milan's training methods and positive reinforcement trainers is that Milan forces a dog to suppress it's fear, while trainers like Ian Dunbar and Jean Donaldson work with the dog to 'extinguish' the fear

[Stephanie]

I just bought the book :D I'll have to review it when I get it.

[Adina P]

I think Cesar is good at what he does and he accomplishes what he wants to accomplish... I personally do not think he's abusive, but that's me.

BUT I do not think he's a trainer or someone to emulate. HE can do it, HE can psssst the heck out of dogs and get them to stop doing things. But there's more to training then getting a dog to STOP something.

Training also involves TEACHING the dog new things ... which I've never really seen him do. He may have talent and charisma, but he lacks experience in teaching/training dogs...only in getting them to stop doing things.

I think there are things to learn from him such as: be confident, improve your timing, stand up straight and get things done...but those aren't training specific.

[Adina P]

I don't think the people who dislike him are jealous.

There are simply people who believe that applying negative things (poking with fingers, tapping with foot, correction collars, reprimands, saying Psssst) is wrong and not as effective as positive training. It's their philosophy and their belief. They are honestly and sincerely offended at the way Cesar handles dogs because they find it to be inhumane. I really think they are sincere and not at all jealous.

[Adina P]

The positive trainers are not saying that dogs are humans. But Cesar's way is based in ONE theory of dog behavior/communication. Lots of other people including many behaviorists and trainers have a different theory that does not coincide with Cesar's theories...

Until we can prove what a dog is thinking we can only guess and pick the theory that makes the most sense to us.

[Nancy, Ned, Clancy, and Charlie]

I think you need to look at different philosophies for training and see what suits your comfort zone. I think Cesar's training methods work for him - especially the calm attitude and being in charge. I haven't looked at his puppy training suggestions. I have only watched his "rescue" methods and I am impressed with what he can do to help dogs I would have given up on.
I am not a fan of treat-based training. Some treats are fine but all of the time - not for me. We took Ned to a really poor treat-based puppy class at 6 months at one of the major pet stores. Ned got somewhat trained - (I take the blame for not following through because I do have a brain and know what I should have done) but the instruction was just weak. Ned stole treats out of the trainer's pouch! AND it worked for him!!!
We are currently using the Dave Dikeman training video - not for little puppies though. It is more "natural consequence" based with praise and your attention as the reward.

[Stella]

I like watching his show and have a couple of his books. You have to remember that he does not claim to be a dog trainer, he 'rehabilitates' dogs. He uses body language to influence a dogs behaviour. I have long been a fan of Monty Roberts, who does exactly the same thing with horses. He too often makes them run as part of the bonding (join up) process. Neither of them are wearing the animal out until it is too tired to comply. Most of the dogs Ceaser sees are under exercised and just bouncing with unchanelled energy.

For obediance training we take both our dogs to classes that are primarily positive reinforcement classes (treat training) which works really well for both of us. But watching Cesar helped me to realise I was somtimes the cause of unwanted behaviour by being anxious or frustrated. Now, I remember to keep calm and focused, and my dogs do the same (most of the time anyway!!).

I think the best way is to read around, watch other DVDs and take the pieces from each that work best for you. That way you develop your own philosophy and training techniques suited to your personality. As long as you don't confuse yourself, or your dog!!

[Krista, Angel, and Toby]

The funny thing about Cesar, though, is that you can use the same philosophies and apply them to human nature as well. Example: I once saw a baby fall in a store. The kid was absolutely fine and on her way to picking herself up and moving on before the mom started having a "poor baby" fit. Then the kid started crying. It made me think of Cesar. If you make a big deal out of it, the dog will have no choice except to make a big deal out of it as well. If you, as a parent, are scared of boats, and you fret and anticipate and stress over even the idea of boats, chances are your kid will also be afraid of boats.

Cesar stresses the importance of calm assertive energy. It's not just for dogs, folks! I use it (or at least try to) when I teach. I still need more practice in the classroom, but I have a mentor who is an expert. Not surprisingly, he is now an admin at a different school. Anyway, he was notorious for being able to handle the kids with BD (behavior disorder) and anger management issues without them slamming a single door or throwing a single chair. I watched him and he would just stay completely calm while the kid exploded with emotions verbally. He wouldn't rise when the kid attacked him verbally or not; he wouldn't raise his voice ever; and he wouldn't back down until he got the result he was looking for, which was a rational discussion. Magic. He was the human's Cesar Millan.

Anyway, my point is that you can learn a lot from Cesar, not just about dogs.

But as he is all about psychology, I wanted to know if Sit and Stay was as good as the other videos. From the previews it looks like he relies on others to show the technique and he makes comments.

[Maryann,Roo and Tigger]

You were right! You got lots of opinions. Basically I agree with Adina. I have trained dogs and horses nearly all of my life. Caesar is a uniquely talented man with dogs. You can see people who have that ability with horses also. I do not particularily disagree with anything he does. I think that it is just not a practical approach for most dog owners. His books and tapes are not detail oriented. There are so many other methods that are well described in detail either on video or in a book that are much easier and therefore more practical for the average person. I like Puppies for Dummies, Dr. Sophia Yin's books and tapes and the videos by David Dykeman. But, and this is a big but, I think all of those are supplemental to paying for lessons for you and your dog from a really good trainer. A really good trainer will have learned from many other good trainers, each of whom use a slightly different system. In addition, a really good trainer will be a really good teacher of humans, because that is what training is about: training people to understand how to train their dog.
Every dog is a little different.